Vhiki yepamhepo: Panguva yeSvondo yeSuperBowl, hofisi yamambo wezvinodhaka yakamhanyisa nhepfenyuro yakabhadharwa ichiedza kubatanidza kushandiswa kwezvinodhaka uye "hondo yehugandanga." Kana ukashandisa zvinodhaka, zviziviso zvakati, unotsigira hugandanga. Chii chaunofunga pane izvi?
Noam Chomsky: Hugandanga hwave kushandiswa uye hwave kushandiswa zvakangofanana nemashandisirwo aiitwa communism. Kana uchida kudzvanya hurongwa, unoridza kadhi rehugandanga. Kana mukasanditevera pane izvi, muri kutsigira hugandanga. Ihwo hucheche, kunyanya kana iwe uchifunga kuti yakawanda yenhoroondo yekutengeswa kwezvinodhaka inofamba kuseri kweCIA uye zvimwe zvirongwa zvekupindira kweUS.
Kudzokera kumagumo ehondo yenyika yechipiri, unoona - uye izvi hazvisi kukakavara, zvakanyatsonyorwa - US inozvibatanidza neFrench Mafia, zvichiita kuti French Connection, iyo yakatonga heroin yekutengesa kuburikidza ne1960s. Chinhu chimwe chete chakaitika neopium muGolden Triangle munguva yeHondo yeVietnam, uye zvakare muAfghanistan panguva yehondo yekurwisana nemaRussia.
WOL: Kutengeserana kwecocaine ndicho chikonzero chakapihwa chekupindira kweUS muhondo yevagari vemuColombia. Semaonero ako, danho rekuita rezvinodhaka inyaya yekunyepedzera kusvika papi? Uye chikonzero chei?
Chomsky: Colombia yakave nerekodhi yakaipisisa yekodzero dzevanhu muhemisphere mumakore gumi apfuura apo yanga iri iyo inotungamira kugamuchira zvombo zveUS uye kudzidziswa kuWestern Hemisphere uye ikozvino iri kumashure kweIsrael neEgypt pasi rose.
Pane hukama hwepedyo hwepedyo hunobata kwenguva yakareba pakati pekutyorwa kwekodzero dzevanhu uye rubatsiro rwemauto eUS uye kudzidziswa. Hakusi kuti US inofarira kutambudza vanhu; ndezvekuti hazvina basa nazvo. Kuhurumende yeUS, kutyorwa kwekodzero dzevanhu chinhu chechipiri.
MuColombia, sekune dzimwe nzvimbo, kutyorwa kwekodzero dzevanhu kunowedzera kuwedzera sezvo nyika ichiedza kudzvanyirira nechisimba kushorwa nekusaenzana, kudzvanyirira, huwori, uye dzimwe mhosva dzehurumende dzisina zvematongerwo enyika. Nyika inoshanduka kuita hugandanga - ndizvo zvanga zvichiitika muColombia kwenguva yakareba, kubva pasati pave nekutengesa zvinodhaka kweColombia.
Counterinsurgency yave ichienderera mberi ikoko kwemakore makumi mana; Mutungamiri Kennedy vakatumira mauto akakosha mishoni kuColombia mukutanga kwema40. Chikumbiro chavo kuhurumende yeColombia chakaitwa nguva pfupi yadarika, uye chaida kuti "paramilitary terror" - aya ndiwo mazwi avo - vachipokana nevanodaidza vanotsigira vanozivikanwa vemakomunisti. MuColombia, izvozvo zvaireva vatungamiriri vebasa, vaprista, vanorwira kodzero dzevanhu, zvichingodaro. Mabhuku emauto eColombia muma1960 akatanga kuratidza zano iri. Mumakore gumi nemashanu apfuura, sezvo US yakawedzera kubatanidzwa, kutyorwa kwekodzero dzevanhu kwakakwira zvakanyanya.
Pane imwe pfungwa yakakomba, ngatiti chikonzero chezvinodhaka chaive chepamutemo. Ngatitii US iri kuedza kubvisa zvinodhaka muColombia. Ko Colombia ine kodzero here yekuputira fodya mumapurazi efodya muKentucky? Vari kugadzira chinhu chinouraya chine ngozi zvikuru kupfuura cocaine. Vazhinji vekuColombia vanofa nezvirwere zvine chekuita nefodya kupfuura vanhu vekuAmerica vanofa necocaine. Ehe, Colombia haina kodzero yekuita izvozvo.
WOOL: Mudzimba, mumatunhu, munharaunda, uye hurumende dzemubatanidzwa dzakashandisa makumi emabhiriyoni emadhora muโhondo yezvinodhaka,โ asi zvinodhaka zvinorambidzwa zvichiri kuwanikwa, zvakachena, uye zvakachipa sezvazvaiva kare. Kana mutemo uyu usiri kuzadzisa chinangwa chayo chakataurwa, chii chauri kuita? Pane imwe mhando yelatent agenda irikupihwa here?
Chomsky: Vakaziva nguva yese kuti hazvishande, vane humbowo hwakanaka kubva kuongororo yavo yekutsvagisa inoratidza kuti kana iwe uchida kubata nekushandisa zvinodhaka, kuita hutsotsi ndiyo nzira yakaipisisa. Chirevo cheRAND chakaita ongororo yekubudirira kwemaitiro akasiyana-siyana emishonga uye yakaona kuti nzira inonyanya kushanda kusvika kure ndeyekudzivirira uye kurapwa.
Chiito chemapurisa chaive pazasi pacho, uye pasi pekuita kwemapurisa kwaive kurambidzwa, uye pazasi maererano nekudhura-kubudirira kwaive kuedza kunze kwenyika, sezviri kuitwa neUS muColombia. Mutungamiri Nixon, zvakasiyana, aive nechikamu chakakosha chekudzivirira uye kurapwa kwaibudirira.
US mutemo wezvinodhaka wemumba hauite zvinangwa zvawo zvakataurwa, uye vanoita zvemitemo vanonyatsoziva izvozvo. Kana zvisiri zvekuderedza kushandiswa kwezvinodhaka, ndezvei? Zviripachena, kubva muzviito zvazvino uye nhoroondo, kuti zvinhu zvinowanzoitwa mhosva kana zvichibatanidzwa neanonzi makirasi ane njodzi, kuti kupara mhosva kwezvimwe zvinhu inzira yekutonga magariro.
Mitemo yehupfumi yemakore makumi maviri apfuura ishanduro yemupfumi yekugadzirisa zvimiro. Iwe unogadzira huwandu hwakawandisa, uhwo mumamiriro eUS hurombo zvakanyanya, vatema, uye Hispanic, uye huwandu hwakakura husingagutsikane mune zvehupfumi.
Iwe unoverenga ese misoro yenyaya nezvehupfumi hukuru, asi chokwadi chakasiyana. Kune ruzhinji, iyi neoliberal mitemo yakave nemhedzisiro yakaipa. Panyaya dzemihoro, takangowana zvakare mwero wemihoro wemakore makumi matatu apfuura. Mihoro inochengetwa chete nekushanda kwenguva yakareba uye nesimba, kana nevakuru vese vari mumhuri vachishanda. Kunyange mwero wekukura kwehupfumi hauna kunge wakakwira zvakadaro, uye kukura kwakadii kwave kwakanyanya mune mamwe masekete.
Kana vanhu vazhinji vasingagutsikani uye vamwe vasina maturo, unoda kubvisa zvisingabatsiri uye kutyisa vasingagutsikani. Hondo yezvinodhaka inoita izvi. Huwandu hwekusungwa kweUS hwakakwira zvakanyanya, zvakanyanya nekuda kwemhosva dzisina mhosva, dzakadai semhosva dzezvinodhaka, uye mitongo yacho inorangwa zvakanyanya. Hondo yezvinodhaka haingobvisi huwandu hwevanhu vakawandisa, inotyisidzira munhu wese.
Zvinodhaka zvinoita sechikomonizimu kana kuti ugandanga, vanhu vanoungana pasi pechiremera kuti vadzivirirwe panjodzi. Zvakaoma kutenda kuti mhedzisiro iyi hainzwisisike. Varipo kuti chero munhu aone. Kare pakatanga nguva yazvino yehondo yezvinodhaka, Senator Moynihan akateerera nezvesaenzi yemagariro, uye akati kana tikapasa mutemo uyu tiri kufunga kugadzira mhirizhonga pakati pevadiki.
Kune vakadzidza, kushandisa zvinodhaka kwese kwaive kuderera mumakore ekuma90s, tingave tichitaura nezve cocaine kana kuputa fodya kana kudya nyama tsvuku. Iyi yaive nguva iyo shanduko yetsika nedzidzo yaiitika izvo zvakaita kuti zvikamu zvakadzidza zvakanyanya kuderedze kudyiwa kwemarudzi ese ezvinhu zvinokuvadza.
Kune varombo, kune rumwe rutivi, kushandiswa kwezvinodhaka kwakaramba kwakagadzikana. Tichitarisa macurves aya, tinoona kuti zvichaitika, zviri pachena kuti munenge mave kuenda after poor sectors. Vamwe vanyori venhoroondo dzemitemo vakafanotaura kuti fodya yaizoitwa mhosva nokuti yakabatana nevarombo nevasina kudzidza.
Kana ukaenda kuMcDonald's, unoona vana vachisvuta fodya, asi ini handisati ndaona mudzidzi akapedza kudzidza akasvuta fodya kwemakore. Isu tave kutanga kuona zvinorangwa zvine chekuita nekuputa, uye chokwadi indasitiri yaona izvi zvichiuya kwemakore. Phillip Morris nevamwe vese vatanga kusiyanisa uye kushandura mashandiro kunze kwenyika.
WOL: Vazhinji vanochinja zvinodhaka vane hasha vanozivikanwa vaRibertarians. Semunhu ane anarchist - ndinofungidzira kuti zvakanaka kukudaidza kuti - chii chaunotora pane libertarianism?
Chomsky: Izwi rekuti libertarian sekushandiswa kwakaitwa muUS rinoreva chimwe chinhu chakasiyana nezvainoreva nhoroondo uye zvichiri kureva kune dzimwe nyika. Nhoroondo, bato rerusununguko rave riri bapiro rinopesana neresocialist. Socialist anarchism yaiva libertarian socialism.
MuUS, inova nzanga inotongwa zvakanyanya nebhizinesi, izwi iri rine chirevo chakasiyana. Zvinoreva kubvisa kana kuderedza kutonga kwehurumende, kunyanya kutonga pamusoro pehudzvanyiriri hwepachivande. MaLibertarians muUS haati ngatibvisei makambani. Irwo rudzi rwe-ultra-rightism.
Ndataura izvozvo, kutaura chokwadi, ndinobvumirana navo pazvinhu zvakawanda. Panyaya yezvinodhaka, vanowanzopikisa kubatanidzwa kwenyika muhondo yezvinodhaka, izvo zvavanotora nenzira chaiyo senzira yekumanikidza uye kunyimwa rusununguko. Unogona kushamisika kuziva kuti mamwe makore apfuura, pasati pave nemagazini akazvimirira akasara, ndainyanya kunyorera magazini yeCato Institute.
WOL: Chii chinofanira kuitwa pamusoro pekushandisa zvinodhaka uye kutengeswa kwezvinodhaka?
Chomsky: Ndinobvumirana neRAND. Idambudziko. Cocaine haina kunaka kwauri. Kana iwe uchida kubata nekushandisa zvinodhaka, nzira yacho inofanira kunge iri dzidzo, kudzivirira, kudzoreredza uye zvichingodaro. Ndizvo zvatakabudirira kuita nezvimwe zvinhu. Hatina kufanira kurambidza fodya kuti tione kudzikiswa kwekushandisa; ndiwo mugumisiro wekuchinja kwetsika nedzidzo.
Mumwe anofanirwa kugara akangwarira mukukurudzira magariro emagariro nekuti hatigone kuziva zvichaitika, asi isu tinofanirwa kunge tichiongorora matanho ekubvisa mhosva. Ngatitorei izvi zvakadzama tione zvichaitika. Nzvimbo iri pachena yekutanga ndeye mbanje. Kurambidza mbanje kunenge kuri kuita zvine musoro. Uye isu tinofanirwa kutanga kubva kuhutsotsi kuenda pakudzivirira. Kudzivirira uye kurapwa ndiwo maitiro atinofanirwa kunge tichigadzirisa zvinodhaka senge cocaine uye heroin.