U-Lula da Silva wamiselwa ixesha lesithathu elingalandelelaniyo njengomongameli waseBrazil, eguqula ngokumangalisayo indlela yelizwe kwiminyaka esibhozo edlulileyo. Kwiintsuku ezimbalwa zokuqala e-ofisini, uLula ubonise utshintsho lomgaqo-nkqubo olunenkqubela ngakumbi kunokuba abaninzi bebekholelwa ukuba lunokwenzeka, utsho intatheli ezimeleyo uMichael Fox.
Ikhonkco kuLula intetho yokusungula ngokupheleleyo, ngesiNgesi
yombhalo
UGreg Wilpert
Wamkelekile kwi Ihlabathi liyatsha. Ndingumgcini wakho, uGreg Wilpert. NgeCawe, nge-1 kaJanuwari, iBrazil yamisela owayesakuba yinkokeli yombutho wabasebenzi kunye noMongameli weQela laBasebenzi uLuiz Inรกcio Lula da Silva, owaziwa ngokuba nguLula, isihlandlo sesithathu esingalandelelanayo njengoMongameli waseBrazil. Ngo-Okthobha odlulileyo, uLula uphumelele ngokuncinci unyulo oluyi-run-off ngokuchasene ne-right-wing u-Jair Bolsonaro kunye ne-50.9% yevoti. U-Lula wayekade ekhonza amagama amabini alandelelanayo njengomongameli ukusuka kwi-2003 ukuya kwi-2010, ngexesha lokuqala laseLatin America elibizwa ngokuba yi-pink tide ye-2000 yokuqala. Emva koko owangena ezihlangwini zakhe, u-Dilma Rousseff, naye owayekwiQela labasebenzi, wasuswa esikhundleni ngo-2016 kwinto abaninzi abayijonga njengobhukuqo-mthetho.
ULula naye ujongene nokutshutshiswa ngobuqhophololo waze wavalelwa entolongweni nanjengoko wayelungiselela ukuba ngumongameli ngo-2018. Emva kweminyaka ephantse ibe mibini evalelwe, wakhululwa waza wakwazi ukungenela umongameli okwesithathu. Ukumiselwa kwangeCawe, ngeendlela ezininzi, kwaba sisiganeko esiyimbali, kungekuphela nje ngenxa yeemeko ezingaqhelekanga ezikhokelele kuko kodwa nangenxa yokuba uLula uye wanikezela kwikhabhinethi apho ilungu elinye kwabathathu ingabafazi.
Ukundijoyina ngoku ukujonga ukuba ikota yesithathu kaLula njengomongameli ingathetha ntoni nguMichael Fox. Uyintatheli ezimeleyo, umhleli wangaphambili wejenali ye-NACLA, kunye nomgcini kunye nomvelisi wepodcast Brazil on Fire. Enkosi ngokundidibanisa nam namhlanje, Mike.
UMichael Fox
Enkosi ngokuba nam, Greg.
UGreg Wilpert
Ke, okokuqala, unokuthi kubaluleke kangakanani ukumiselwa kukaLula kwithuba lesithathu elingalandelelanayo njengomongameli waseBrazil?
UMichael Fox
Ndiyathetha, yi-180 epheleleyo. Iphelele malunga nobuso. Inkulu. Lutshintsho olupheleleyo lweBrazil. Unikezelo ngokwalo lwalunamandla, lunabantu abangama-200,000 ezitratweni. Baninzi abantu abathetha ngethemba, bathetha ngokubuyela kwidemokhrasi. Njengoko sele ukhankanyile, bekukho uqhushululu ngokuchasene noDilma Rousseff, emva koko abantu abaninzi babona ukuvalelwa kukaLula emva koko kunyulo lukaBolsonaro njengawo onke amanye amanqwanqwa obhukuqo-mbuso. Ke ngoku, eBrazil, oku kubuyela kwidemokhrasi, ukubuya kwethemba. Njengoko bonke abaphulaphuli bakho besazi, iBolsonaro izise izinto ezininzi ezahlukeneyo: ukongama kwabamhlophe, iindaba ezingeyonyani, kunye nokuhlaselwa kwabantu abamnyama, abantu bomthonyama. Oku kuvula umnyango wobuso obupheleleyo kwinto ebesinayo ukuza kuthi ga ngoku. Ukuqaliswa ngokwenene kwabeka isiseko kuloo nto.
UGreg Wilpert
Ngoko makhe sijonge kwikhabhinethi. Okokuqala, njengoko benditshilo, ilungu elinye kwabathathu ngabasetyhini, ngaphezulu okanye ngaphantsi. Ndicinga ukuba yayiyi-11 kwi-30 into, ngokungathandabuzekiyo inani eliphezulu, ndicinga, kuyo nayiphi na iKhabhinethi kwimbali yaseBrazil. Yintoni esiyaziyo ngamanye amalungu aphambili ale khabhinethi, kwaye singalindela ntoni kuwo?
UMichael Fox
Ewe, into yokuqala yiWorkers Party, ekucacayo ukuba lipati kaLula. Yangena emandleni ngemanyano ebanzi kakhulu yeKhohlo, iZiko, kunye namaqela asekunene. Khumbula ukuba iqabane lakhe, uSekela Mongameli uGeraldo Alkman, wayelutshaba lwakhe olukhulu phaya ngo-2006. Ngumfo owakhuphisana noLula ngo-2006. Ngenene wanqumla indlela ukuzisa wonke umntu okwinkampu yomanyano lwedemokrasi, kwaye nantso into eyayimalunga nephulo lakhe lonke. Yayimalunga nokuzisa wonke umntu kangangoko kunokwenzeka. Ke, ewe, yiloo nto ikhabhinethi yakhe nayo ibonakala ngathi.
Ikota yezo zihlalo ziye kumalungu eWorkers Party, izihlalo ezilithoba. Ezo zinkonzo eziphambili kuLula. Ngoko ke yi-makeup. Nimalunga ne-9 Workers Party ministries, kwaye ke amanye amasebe ahlulwe phakathi kwaloo maqela, amasebe amathathu kwiqela ngalinye.
Ngoku, phakathi kwe-Workers Party, unama-ofisi abaluleke kakhulu, njengoMphathiswa wezeMali kunye noFernando Haddad, owayengumgqatswa wangaphambili wobumongameli owabalekela i-Workers Party xa, ngokuqinisekileyo, uLula wakhutshelwa ngaphandle ngo-2018. Flรกvio Dino, owayesakuba yiRhuluneli yaseMaranhรฃo, kwaye ibaluleke kakhulu. Walwa neBolsonaro. Ungomnye wezona zitshaba zikaBolsonaro ngexesha lakhe ekulawuleni, kwaye ngoku unguMphathiswa wezoBulungisa. Ke oko kuphakathi kweQela labasebenzi.
Ukwanayo-kwaye le yeyona nto ibalulekileyo, Greg. Zonke ezi nkonzo zintsha, ezininzi zazo, kwaye zibandakanya uMphathiswa wezeMisebenzi, iSebe lezeMisebenzi, iSebe lezoBulungisa bezobuhlanga, kwaye ngokwenene, umfazi, udade kaMarielle Franco, ngoku unguMphathiswa wezoBulungisa bobuhlanga okanye ukulingana ngokobuhlanga. Oku kubaluleke kakhulu kuba kuzisa onke amanye amacandelo, kwaye iKhohlo liphumelele kakhulu kwiindawo ezininzi ezahlukeneyo.
Ngoku, into enkulu abantu abaninzi abathetha ngayo, ewe, liSebe lezeNdalo. Umqolo kaMarina Silva, khumbula, wayenguMphathiswa wezeNdalo iminyaka emithandathu okanye esixhenxe phantsi kweLula. Wayengoyena ndoqo ekubuyiseleni umva ekugawulweni kwamahlathi, enqumla ukugawulwa kwamahlathi ngesiqingatha kuloo minyaka mibini yokuqala kurhulumente wokuqala kaLula. Emva koko baxambulisana. Wabalekela kumongameli amatyeli aliqela, emva koko baphinda bakha ubudlelwane babo, kwaye leyo ibe yenye yezinto ezichulumancisayo ngephulo likaLula nokumbona ebuyela eqongeni. Phofu ebefungiswa nje izolo, kwaye umgca wokufunga kwakhe okanye wokuvulwa kwakhe ibingowona mde kuyo yonke iminyhadala eyahlukeneyo yabefundisi eyenzekayo ngoku.
Ewe, obunye ubufundisi obubalulekileyo obutsha liSebe lezaBantu boMthonyama, elikhokelwa nguSonia Guajajara, ongomnye wabalwela amalungelo emveli abalulekileyo eBrazil. Uyinkokeli ye-APIB [Articulaรงรฃo dos Povos Indรญgenas do Brasil], eyona ntlangano inkulu yemveli. Ewe kunjalo, wayehlala esilwa norhulumente waseBolsonaro, kwaye ngoku unguMphathiswa waBantu boMthonyama. Ukubeka nje oku ngokwembono, okokuqala, akuzange kubekho Mphathiswa waBantu boMthonyama, kwaye akuzange kubekho mphathiswa womthonyama ngaphambili. Enyanisweni, wayengumfundisi wokuqala ngqa ukufungiswa ngeCawa. Uye waphakama, wanxiba ilokhwe enentsiba. Xa babefota abefundisi balapho bekunye noLula, wayemi kanye ecaleni kukaLula. Kwelinye icala likaSekela Mongameli uGerald Alkman yayinguAnielle Franco, ongudadewabo kaMarielle Franco. Lo ngumzuzu oxelayo ukuba uLula utyhala iyantlukwano, unyanzelisa ukuqukana, kwaye hayi nje ngaphakathi kwiSebe ngokwalo, kodwa uLula uye waphuma wabuza uJoรชnia Wapichana ukuba uzakuba yintloko yeFUNAI [Fundaรงรฃo Nacional dos Povos. Indรญgenas].
Ngoku i-FUNAI iluhlobo lwe-Arhente yeMicimbi yeMveli. Kwahlala kunjalo. Nangona igama laliyi-Arhente yeMicimbi yaseIndiya kwaye ngoku isiSiseko seSizwe saBantu boMthonyama. Ngoko batshintsha igama. Ngoku uyintloko yaloo nto, kwaye le arhente ngoku iphantsi koMphathiswa waBantu boMthonyama. Utyhala olubaluleke kakhulu. Sele bethetha ngokufuna ukucanda imida yemimandla eyahlukeneyo yemveli eli-13 kule nyanga yokuqala. Zininzi ke izinto ezenzekileyo. Ikhabhinethi eneneni inika umdla ngokwenene. Yindlela eqhubela phambili ngakumbi kunokuba abantu bebecinga ukuba inokwenzeka.
Kukho omnye umntu endicinga ukuba ubalulekile, nguSimone Tebet, ngoku onguMphathiswa woCwangciso noHlahlo-lwabiwo-mali. Ngoku, ebengundoqo kuba ufumene inani lesithathu uninzi lweevoti kolu lonyulo. Uphuma kwi-PMDB okanye iQela le-MDB, eliliqela elinelungelo eliphambili. Kodwa indoda, emva kolonyulo lomjikelo wokuqala, waphuma elwela uLula. Uphume ehlasela uBolsonaro ngebhajethi yakhe eyimfihlo, esithi yayinokuba lelona hlazo likhulu emhlabeni ngelo xesha. Wayekhuthele ngokwenene ngendlela abantu abaninzi ababengayilindelanga. Ngoku unesihlalo sakhe sekhabhathi. Iyonwabisa ngokwenene. Kuyavuyisa kuKhohlo ukubona abantu abaninzi abahlukeneyo besiya kulawulo, kwiKhabhinethi kaLula, benemibono ecace gca yokuba bafuna ukuyithatha phi le nto, kwaye inika imincili intshukumo eqhubekayo, ejonge phambili apha.
UGreg Wilpert
Ukhankanye, ngokukhawuleza, uMarielle Franco kunye nodadewabo uAnielle kwikhabhathi. Abantu abaninzi banokungazi ukuba ngubani uMarielle. Ngaba ungashwankathela ngokufutshane ukuba ungubani kwaye yintoni intsingiselo yokuba udade wabo ekwikhabhinethi?
UMichael Fox
Ilungile lo nto. Ngoko u-Marielle wayelilungu leBhunga lesiXeko esimnyama saseRio de Janeiro owadutyulwa ngo-2018. Ithumele i-shockwaves ejikeleze iBrazil kuba yayibonisa ukuba kwakukho nje (A) akukho bulungisa, akukho ntlonipho kuluntu olumnyama, kunye nabapolitiki abamnyama kunye neenkokeli. Ngoko uqhanqalazo lwenzeka kwilizwe lonke. Kwaba ngathi ngumzuzu woBomi oMnyama eBrazil nakwihlabathi liphela, eneneni, ngenxa yento awayeyifuzisela iBrazil, kwaye iyaqhubeka nokuba neenguqulelo. Igama lakhe lisaqhubeka libaluleke kakhulu. U-Anielle, udade wabo, emva koko wenza i-Marielle Franco Institute kwaye ebezama ukuphakamisa igama lakhe ukususela ngoko kunye naloo mfanekiso. Into yokuba ngoku enguMphathiswa woLingano ngokobuhlanga yeyona nto ibalulekileyo. Injalo, ibaluleke kakhulu.
Ukubeka oku ngokwembono, emva kowama-2018, xa iBolsonaro yayilwela igunya, kwakukho abantu abamanyene neBolsonaro abaphumelele iofisi, abezomthetho abaphumelele iofisi, ababethathe imiqondiso, imiqondiso kaMarielle. Babezaphula kulo mfanekiso wokubonisa ukuba uMarielle akayena nje uBolsonaro kunye noogxa bakhe. Wayengento yanto. Umfanekiso woluntu olumnyama, uluntu lwe-LGBT, kunye noluntu lwemveli [inaudible 00:09:28], alunaxabiso nje eli lizwe. Yiyo loo nto siye sabona ukutyhala kakhulu kule minyaka mine idlulileyo kunye nokuchaswa okungaka kwimibutho yentlalontle. Ngoku, yiyo loo nto abantu bechwayitile kakhulu malunga nokubakho kwethemba elingaka kunye nokwenzeka kulo rhulumente mtsha waseLula.
UGreg Wilpert
Ngoku, ucinga ukuba singalindela ntoni kuLula malunga nemigaqo-nkqubo yakhe yasekhaya? Ziziphi ezona zinto zibalulekileyo? Kwakhona, ucinga ukuba ubungakanani bezenzo zakhe bunokuba buncinci, kuba akanalo uninzi kwiCongress? Oko kukuthi, ngaba ebeya kukwazi nokuwisa nayiphi na imithetho emitsha ebalulekileyo?
UMichael Fox
Ngoko, imibuzo enkulu. Okokuqala, uye wacaca kakhulu malunga nokuba yintoni ugxininiso lwakhe kwimigaqo-nkqubo yasekhaya kunye nokunciphisa intlupheko. Yiloo nto yayiyiyo kwiimpawu zakhe zokuqala ezimbini. Ufuna ukuphinda aphakamise abantu kwintlupheko kuba, ngokuqinisekileyo, siye sabona amanani entlupheko anyukile, ukungalingani kunyukile, kwaye indlala ikhulile. Le yenye yezinto. Ngokwenene walila, uGreg, kwintetho yakhe yokusungulwa xa wayethetha ngabantu abacela imali esitratweni kunye nabantu abacela ukutya kuba eli lizwe alishiyi. Xa eshiya i-ofisi kunye ne-87% yokuvunywa kwe-reyithingi emva ekuqaleni kwe-2010, i-Brazil yayiphelise intlupheko. UDilma wenza okungakumbi kwelo nyathelo. Ngoko ke le yeyona nto ibalulekileyo. Uthethile ngokubuyisela impilo kunye nokubuyisela i-SUS [iSistema รnico de Saรบde], inkqubo yokhathalelo lwempilo karhulumente, kuba, ewe, loo nto yatshatyalaliswa phantsi kweBolsonaro.
Ugxininiso lwakhe oluninzi, ngakumbi kwezi nyanga zizayo, luza kuhlaziya ezo nkqubo kunye nezo arhente zaye zagxothwa zaza zangenziwa nguBolsonaro. Sele sikubonile oku, eneneni, kwimimiselo yakhe kwiiyure ezingama-24 zokuqala. Uthintele amashishini abucala asibhozo ahlukeneyo amashishini karhulumente, kubandakanya iPetrobras, inkampani yeoyile karhulumente, kubandakanya iCorreios, inkonzo yeposi. Wawuphinda ummiselo kaBolsonarodo wangaphambili owawukhulula kwaye ukhulula iingalo zabantu kwilizwe liphela. Ngoko uyaziqinisa ezo. Wawususa unyaka we-100 [ulwimi lwasemzini 00:11:37] okanye imfihlo eyayibekwe nguBolsonaro kwizinto ezininzi, uhlobo lwayo nantoni na uBolsonaro afuna ukuyenza. Upasise imimiselo esixhenxe eyahlukeneyo yokusingqongileyo, kubandakanywa ukuvala imigodi kwimimandla yemveli kunye nokuvula ingxowa-mali ye-Amazon kwakhona ukuze abantu bakwazi ukutyalomali eBrazil abavela kumazwe ahlukeneyo.
Yiloo nto kanye ayenzileyo kwiiyure zakhe zokuqala ezingama-24. Umgaqo-nkqubo wakhe wasekhaya uza kugxila kakhulu ekupheliseni intlupheko. Ukwathethile, ewe, ufuna ukumisa ukugawulwa kwamahlathi e-Amazon, kodwa kwangaxeshanye, ufuna ukugcina uqoqosho luqhuba. Yiloo nto wayeyilungele ngokwenene emva kwimiqathango yakhe yokuqala emibini. Akazange aphakamise abantu kwintlupheko aze ayenze njengomonakalo kumashishini aseBrazil, kodwa ngokwenene wawaphakamisa amashishini aseBrazil, akwazi ukuwafumana phesheya kwaye awagcine esenza imali eninzi kunanini na ngaphambili, kwaye yinto afuna ukuyenza. qhubeka ukwenza.
Wathi, ewe, ngokukodwa ngeAmazon, loo mbonakalo, โsinokuqhubeka sisiba sisitya sesonka sehlabathi kwaye singagawuli ihlathi enye iimitha enye yehlathi lethu. Akukho mfuneko yokuba sigawule omnye umthi.โ Ngoko oko kubaluleke kakhulu kuye. Inxalenye yaloo nto ikwazi ukuphosa imali kunye nokuphosa izixhobo kunye neemali zamafama asekuhlaleni kunye namafama amancinci asekuhlaleni. Yayisisitshixo eso. Yinto ayenzileyo kakhulu emva kwimiba yakhe emibini yokuqala. Yinto afuna ukuyenza kwakhona. Yayiluncedile ngokwenene ukulima kwezolimo. Kwangaxeshanye, ugxile kwizinto zakhe zokuphelisa intlupheko. Sele eyibuyisele kwakhona i-Bolsa Famรญlia, nto leyo, ngokuqinisekileyo, inkqubo yakhe yokutshintshela imali ngokwemiqathango emva kweminyaka yoo-2000. Uthi iintsapho ezihluphekayo ziza kufumana iireals ezingama-600 ngenyanga, ngaphezulu nje kweedola ezili-100.
Ke ezi zonke zizinto eziphambili ngokwenene ekungenzima kangako kuye ukuba azenze, akwazile ukuzenza ukuza kuthi ga ngoku. Kakade ke, akakwazi ukuwisa amadolo amashishini abalulekileyo, ishishini lezolimo, kunye nezinto ezinjalo. Ke lo izakuba ngumceli mngeni aya kuba nawo, kwaye ngakumbi umceli mngeni kwikhabhinethi yakhe, ukufumana iindlela anokuthi akwazi ukutyhala ukukhusela iAmazon, ukuxhasa imiba yemveli, inkxaso, yithi, iMST [Movimento dos Trabalhadores Rurais Sem Terra] kunye namafama amancinci asekuhlaleni ngexesha elinye njengoko engalufulatheleli ushishino olukhulu lwezolimo.
Enye into eye yagutyungelwa ngokwenene phantsi kweBolsonaro, uGreg, lishishini. Le yayiyinto uBolsonaro ngokusisiseko esandula ukuyifulathela, kwaye yonke ingcamango phantsi kweBolsonaro yayikukuthengisa ishishini laseBrazil kangangoko kunokwenzeka kwaye kugxininise ngokwenene kwiimarike zeempahla kunye nokuthengisa iimarike zokuthumela ngaphandle. Yayiyinto yakhe enkulu leyo. ULula uvela kwimbono eyahluke ngokupheleleyoโ uphuhliso. Ukuthi, "hayi, ngokwenene sifuna ishishini laseBrazil. Sifuna amashishini aseBrazil, kwaye sifuna ukunceda ukuqalisa oko kwilizwe liphela. โ Ngaloo mibono mibini yehlabathi lokunciphisa intlupheko kunye nophuhliso, kufuneka sakhe amashishini aseBrazil kwakhona; azikho ukuchasana. Bahamba kunye.
Ngoku, njengale nto usandula ukubuza ngayo, uza kuyenza njani le nto ngeNkongolo ecacileyo? Lo ngumbuzo omkhulu. Ndicinga ukuba mhlawumbi ngomnye weyona mibuzo mikhulu ibuzwa ngabantu abaninzi kuba, njengoko usazi, abantu abaninzi beza, amahlakani eBolsonaro, kwaye yiNkongolo egcinayo. Kwangaxeshanye, i-Workers Party ayinamqolo wayo eludongeni. Enyanisweni, i-PT, ngeli xesha, inabantu abaninzi kwiCongress njengoko yenza ngaphambi kokuba yonke i-scandal ye-Lava Jato yokuhlamba imoto. Ngoko kwacaca kakhulu kolunyulo lokugqibela ukuba abantu babezimisele ukuvotela i-PT kumanqanaba afanayo ababewenza phantsi kweminyaka yokuqala yeDilma nangaphantsi kweminyaka yeLula. Ke leyo yingongoma enye abantu abaninzi abayiphosileyo xa bebethetha malunga nokwakheka kwendlu yowiso-mthetho. Kuza kubakho indlu yowiso-mthetho elondolozayo.
Enye into ebaluleke kakhulu, nangona kunjalo. Uninzi lwabalingane baseBolsonaro kwiCongress abaqhelanga ukwenza inkcaso. Basuka kumaqela aphambili, into eyaziwa ngokuba yiCentrao, kwaye la maqela afana ne-PMDB. Mhlawumbi baye batsiba inqanawa kwaye bajoyina amaqela amaninzi eBolsonaro, kodwa aba ngabantu abaqhele ukuba phakathi kwaye bahlala bejoyina nabani na osemagunyeni. Oku kuya kuba yinto enomdla ngokwenene ukubona indlela abadlala ngayo inkcaso okanye musa ukudlala inkcaso kwiinyanga ezizayo kunye neminyaka ezayo. Ndicinga ukuba okuninzi koku kuya kuxhomekeka ekubeni unamandla kangakanani uBolsonaro ngokwakhe.
Ndiyazi ukuba siza kungena kule nto, kodwa uBolsonaro ulishiyile ilizwe. Walishiya kwangethuba ilizwe. Abanye abantu baya kuthi ubalekile. Uninzi lwabaxhasi bakhe kunye namahlakani akhe abanelisekanga nguye kuba bavakalelwa kukuba umnikele umva ngokupheleleyo. Ke umbuzo weBolsonaro izakuba ngumbuzo obaluleke ngokwenene ukuya phambili, kwaye asazi ukuba singawuphendula njani ngoku.
Ngokumalunga nokuqulunqwa kwendlu yowiso-mthetho, uLula usenawo onke amathuba okutyhala kwizinto acinga ukuba zibalulekile. Asiyiyo yonke into eyenziwa kusetyenziswa indlu yowiso-mthetho. Ayiyiyo yonke into eyenziwa kwiCongress kunye neSenate. Jonga esele sikubonile kule veki kwimimiselo yakhe. Bezibaluleke kakhulu. Uza kuqhubeka nokwenza ezo ngendlela efanayo neBolsonaro- walawula kakhulu ngommiselo amaxesha amaninzi. Ndicinga ukuba uLula uza kukwazi ukwenza okuninzi. Sele ekwenzile. Sele enayo, kodwa uya kukwazi ukwenza okuninzi ngakumbi kunokuba abantu abaninzi bamnika ikhredithi.
Ngoku, ngaba uya kukwazi ukukhupha isisu ngokusemthethweni? Hayi, loo nto ayingombandela aza kufumana ukutsalwa kuwo. Kutheni kunjalo? Ngenxa yokuba umbutho weVangeli ukhule kakhulu. Ayiyiyo into anokuthi aqhubeke nayo ngeli xesha. Uyakwazi ukuqhubela phambili kwezinye izinto ezininzi, kwaye ezo zibe yingqwalasela yakhe ecacileyo kakhulu malunga neenyanga.
UGreg Wilpert
Kulungile, ndifuna ukujika ngoku kwimigaqo-nkqubo kaLula yamazwe ngamazwe, apho kunokwenzeka ukuba unenkululeko encinci kunemiba yasekhaya. Ngexesha lokuqala elipinki, uLula, kunye nowayesakuba nguMongameli u-Hugo Chavez waseVenezuela, baba negalelo ekusekeni imibutho emitsha yengingqi, njenge-CELAC, uLuntu lweZizwe zaseLatin America kunye neCaribbean, kunye ne-UNASUR, iManyano yeZizwe zaseMzantsi Melika. , eziye zawa zombini xa i-pink tide yokuqala yaphelayo. Ngoku, sinokulindela ntoni kuLula ngeli xesha?
UMichael Fox
Ewe, oku kuyonwabisa ngokwenene. Kubantu bamazwe aphesheya, sesinye sezona ziqwenga zinomdla kakhulu kuba, ewe, phantsi kweBolsonaro, iBrazil ibinomgaqo-nkqubo wangaphandle ogxile e-US kuphela kodwa ogxile kuTrump. Nantoni na elungileyo kuTrump ilungile kuthi. Ewe kunjalo, oko kushiye iBrazil emoyeni kule minyaka mibini idlulileyo, ingazi kakuhle ukuba mandenze ntoni xa uTrump ephumile kwiofisi kwiminyaka emibini edlulileyo. Umgaqo-nkqubo wamazwe angaphandle ngoku uza kuba malunga nobuso ngokupheleleyo. ULula sele ethethile oko, kwaye ngokunjalo noMphathiswa wakhe wezangaphandle, uMauro Vieira, owayenguMphathiswa Wezangaphandle phantsi kukaDilma Rousseff. Uye wacaca kakhulu ukuba uyalelwe ukuba agxininise kwizinto ezintathu eziphambili, ukuqala, nguLula, kwaye ezo zibophelelo zokuqala zaseMzantsi Melika, emva koko zidibanisa zaseLatin America, emva koko zidibanisa zaseAfrika. Ezo, ngokuqinisekileyo, zazibaluleke kakhulu kuLula phaya kwiminyaka yoo-2000. Yonke into yakhe yayibubudlelwane bomzantsi-mazantsi, indibaniselwano yengingqi, kunye nokwakha obo budlelwane kunye neAfrika okokuqala. Wavula amaziko ozakuzo amatsha angama-35 ebudeni bolawulo lwakhe ezibini ebudeni baloo minyaka, yaye waya kumazwe angaphezu kwama-50 kwiminyaka esibhozo. Andazi ukuba wayenza njani, kodwa wayenza. Ungunozakuzaku omkhulu. Sayibona loo nto kwi-COP-27 xa wayelapho. Kwakusele iiveki ezimbini kuphela emva konyulo lwakhe. Wayengekabi ngumongameli, kwaye wamkelwa njengenkwenkwezi yaseJiphutha. Oku kuya kuba yingozi kakhulu kwiBrazil. Kukuphakamisela iBrazil umva ukuya kwinqanaba lamazwe ngamazwe, ukwazi ukuthetha nawona mazwe atyebileyo ehlabathi, kodwa ungaqubudi kula mazwe atyebileyo kwaye ukwazi ngokwenene ukugcina iBrazil ikweli nqanaba lehlabathi kwaye ube nobudlelwane naye wonke umntu.
Sayibona loo nto xa kwakusungulwa. Ndicinga ukuba oku kunomdla ngokwenene, Greg. Abathunywa bamazwe angaphandle abangamashumi amathandathu anesihlanu abohlukeneyo beza kumsitho wokumiselwa kukaLula, kuquka neentloko ezilishumi elinesithoba ezohlukeneyo zombuso. Asizange siyibone into enje ngaphambili. Ebudeni belo xesha, ngoxa sasibukele ukudlula kwabathunywa abahlukahlukeneyo abavela kwamanye amazwe, okokuqala nayibona iUkraine; abathunywa baseUkraine beza baza baxhawula uLula, yaye emva kwabo kwakukho iRashiya. Ke ibonisa indlela uLula azimisele ngayo ukuncokola naye wonke umntu emhlabeni, kwaye uzakuba nobudlelwane obuqinileyo naye wonke umntu. Nguye umxoxisi omkhulu ngaloo ndlela.
Ngoku, ukudityaniswa kommandla kunye namaqhina asezantsi-emzantsi yenye yezona zinto zinomdla kulo mbuzo uphela kuba le yi-pink tide 2.0, eneneni, ngaphandle kwenyani asinayo i-revolutionary socialism yenkulungwane yama-21. Asiyonguquko epinki. Uninzi lwaba rhulumente mhlawumbi beza kulawulo lohlobo lokuyikhupha, njengoLula. Uphumelele ngeevoti ezizigidi ezi-2, i-2%. Kodwa kunjalo, uninzi lwamazwe aseLatin America okwangoku asekhohlo okanye asekhohlo, kwaye oko kuya kubaluleke kakhulu. ULula sele etshilo ukuba ufuna ukuya phambili ngesantya esiphezulu nge-UNASUR. Inokwenzeka ukuba, intlanganiso yakhe yokuqala yamazwe ngamazwe iya kuba eArgentina kwiNkomfa ye-CELAC, apho uya kuphinda aphinde abuyele eBrazil kwintlanganiso yamazwe ngamazwe. Abantu abaninzi bathetha ngokubaluleka kwe-UNASUR entsha kunye nethuba lokuvuselela i-UNASUR okanye ukuyikhaba kwakhona njengoko singabonanga ixesha elide. Ngoko oku ngenene, ngundoqo ngokwenene. Enyanisweni, oko kuthethwe nguMphathiswa Wezangaphandle kaLula, kunye noLula uthe, "akukokwakha nje le mizimba, kodwa ukuya phambili," yinto abafuna ukuyibona. Ingaba kudityaniswa kwengingqi kujongeka njani ukuya ngaphaya koko sakubonayo phaya kwiminyaka yoo-2000? Ngoko iyamangalisa ngokwenene.
Siza kubona ukuba ezi nyanga zimbini zizayo zithetha ukuthini kwaye zijongeka njani njengoko amazwe ahlukeneyo encokola. Kodwa ukukunika nje ingqiqo kancinane kule nto sijonge kuyo, iintloko ezintandathu ezahlukeneyo zeenkokeli zadibana noLula kusuku nje emva kokumiselwa kwakhe, bethetha ngendlela esiya phambili ngayo, senzani, sirhweba ngantoni. ijongeka njani, bunjani ubudlelwane bethu? Ke yile nto siza kuyibona kwiinyanga ezizayo.
UGreg Wilpert
Ndifuna nje ukujika ngokufutshane kwinqanaba olwenzileyo ngaphambili malunga noloyiso oluncinci olwalunalo uLula kunye nenyaniso, ngokuqinisekileyo, ukuba iikampu zikaLula kunye neBolsonaro zazikude kakhulu ngokuthetha kwezopolitiko. Ngaba oko kuthetha ukuba uluntu lwaseBrazil lwahlulelene ngokunzulu? Uyiqonda njani loo nto? Kukho ulwahlulo olukhulu, ngoko kuthetha, kunye nolwahlulo oluncinci olunjalo, kwakhona, ngengqiqo yenkxaso yabemi kwicala ngalinye.
UMichael Fox
Ke kukho izinto ezininzi ezahlukeneyo zokukhupha apha. Okokuqala, ngokuqinisekileyo, yahlulwe ngokunzulu, kwaye yahlulwe njengokuba bekungazange kube ngaphambili. Yahlulwe phantse njengaleyo sayibona eVenezuela emva kweminyaka yoo-2000 okanye njengale siyibonayo e-United States ngoku kunye noTrump. Ndiyathetha, lilifa lomfanekiso weTrump kunye nesitayile seTrump yezopolitiko eyazuzwa nguBolsonaro kwaye yathatha ngokupheleleyo: ukutyhala iindaba ezingeyonyani kunye nokutyhala le ajenda yobuzwe, ukuhlasela, ukuhlasela, ukuhlasela kwelinye icala kunye neKhohlo kunye nantoni na. Ixhalabisa kakhulu.
Enye yezinto kunye nenxalenye yesizathu solu lwahlulo ngokucacileyo ziindaba zomgunyathi, ukuchazwa kakubi kwezinto esizibonileyo nakwiindawo zokuvota, inkqubo yonke yonyulo, nayo yonke into phantsi konyulo. Le yayiyenye yezo zihlandlo; olu lonyulo yayilelona xesha lijijekileyo kwaye ligqwethiweyo ngokweendaba zobuxoki kunye nogqweso nje olutsha kunye nolwazi olungelulo olutyhalwa mihla le liphulo likaBolsonaro. Ngoko oku kubaluleke kakhulu.
Jonga, into, nangona kunjalo, uGreg, abantu abaninzi endathetha nabo ngexesha lonyulo xa ndandilapho, kwaye ndandilapho ndibika kwilizwe lonke, uninzi lwabo lukwibhodi ngokupheleleyo neBolsonaro. Into abandixelele yona nangaphambi kwevoti yomjikelo wesibini yayikukuba, โjonga, ukuba iBolsonaro, okokuqala, siyazi ukuba sibaninzi,โ abantu baseBolsonaro yayisisininzi, โke ukuba iBolsonaro ayiphumeleli, kulungile, ke siyazi ukuba kukho undonakele kwinkqubo yonyulo, ngoko bekufanele ukuba uphumelele.โ Yiyo loo nto sabona abantu bakhe phandle ezitalatweni kamva kuba umbono okhoyo ngokholo. Iphantse yafana nenkolelo yonqulo. Ayikokuba nomdlalo wedemokhrasi ngokwenene kunye nokuzama ukufumanisa indlela esisebenzisana ngayo kwinkqubo yedemokhrasi. Hayi, imalunga nokutshabalalisa umchasi wakho. Yiloo nto esiyibonileyo kwincinci yokugqibela. Yiyo loo nto, kwilizwe lonke, abantu bahlangana, abaxhasi beBolsonaro bahlangana phambi kwenkampu yomkhosi, bebiza umkhosi ukuba ujike uthintele unyulo lukaLula kwaye ugcine uBolsonaro esemandleni. Abantu bakholelwa ngokwenene oko. Sithetha ngamawaka abalandeli beBolsonaro ababekholelwa ukuba xa beqhankqalaza phambi kwenkampu yomkhosi, umkhosi wawuzakubaxhasa. Inyani yokuba ngenene bayikholelwa loo nto, kwaye bayaqhubeka beyenza iinyanga neenyanga, kwaye ngenene babecinga ukuba iBolsonaro yayiza kufumana indlela yokumisela uhlobo oluthile lobhukuqo-mbuso ngaxa lithile iphathelene nokuba kuthetha ukuthini eBrazil. idemokhrasi, ukuba kuthetha ukuthini ukuya phambili, nokuba kuthetha ntoni kuLula.
Ndicinga ukuba kunokwenzeka ukuba siza kukubona kwiiveki ezizayo nakwiinyanga ezizayo, nangona okwangoku, kukho uhlobo lwesi sigaba esingacacanga malunga nendlela abantu baseBolsonaro abaza kuququzelela ngayo. Phantse akukho mathandabuzo okuba baza kuququzela njengeqela elichasayo nanjengenkcaso ecace gca, ngakumbi ezitratweni, ngakumbi ngeendaba ezingeyonyani eziza kulwa noLula, kwaye abantu baza kuphuma ezitalatweni njengabaxhasi bakaTrump. bebephandle. Siyibonile le nto ezindabeni ngoku, Greg. Ukususela ekumiselweni kukaLula, uye wabona kwi-Twitter, kunye nabantu kwimidiya yoluntu bathi, "jonga, uLula akazange anyukele kwibhotwe likamongameli. Akazange amiselwe. Akazange afunge ngesandla sakhe kwiCongress. Akwenzekanga. Ngalo naliphi na ixesha, uBolsonaro uza kubhabha ebuya eFlorida, kwaye uza kuthatha amandla. โ Abantu bakholelwa ngokwenene oku, kwaye kumajelo asekuhlaleni. Nantsi into edlula kwi-What's App kwiinethiwekhi zentlalo phakathi kwabaxhasi beBolsonaro. Ngoko kuyakhathaza ngokwenene ukuba oku kuyinyani yokwenyani. Ibonisa i-polarization, kodwa ikwabonisa injongo ecacileyo liqela elithile labantu ukuhlasela idemokhrasi yaseBrazil, ukuthumbuza amandla okuba uLula aphumelele.
Le ngenye yezinto iNkundla ePhakamileyo, iNkundla ePhakamileyo yaseBrazil icace kakhulu, kwaye baye baphanda iminyaka emininzi yokuhlaselwa kwentando yesininzi yaseBrazil. Kungenxa yoko le nto abantu abaninzi bethetha ngezityholo ezinokubakho kunye nolwaphulo-mthetho ngokuchasene ne-Bolsonaro kwaye kusenokwenzeka ukuba unokuma ematyaleni ezinye zezi zinto. Yiyo ke le nto, ngokweengxelo esizivileyo, yayikukuba xa emka kwiintsuku ezimbini phambi kwexesha, kungenxa yokuba amagqwetha akhe, ngokokuqonda kwethu, amcebisa ngelithi, โHeyi, inokuba licebo elihle ukuba utsibe kancinci edolophini. lumani niphume kweli lizwe, kuba kusenokwenzeka ukuba niza emva kwenu.โ
Ngosuku lokuqala emva kokumiselwa kukaLula, iPSOL [Partido Socialismo e Liberdade], iqela elincinane lasekhohlo elahlukana neWorkers Party ngo-2005 kodwa ngoku libuyele kumfelandawonye, โโngokwenene lacela kwiNkundla ePhakamileyo ukuba iNkundla ePhakamileyo icele. Intolongo yothintelo evela eBolsonaro ngenxa yolwaphulo-mthetho, ulwaphulo-mthetho oluchasene noluntu, ukuxoka ngexesha lonyulo, ukuhlaselwa kwedemokhrasi kunye nokutyhala imikhosi. Kukho iintlobo ezahlukeneyo zolwaphulo-mthetho kunye nezityholo ezichasene neBolsonaro zibuyela, ewe, kuphando lweSenethi kwi-COVID-19, oluthathe phantse iinyanga ezisibhozo okanye ezisithoba. Ukuphuma kwabo, bathi iBolsonaro inoxanduva lolwaphulo-mthetho oluninzi olusithoba, kubandakanya nolwaphulo-mthetho olujoliswe eluntwini. Ke yonke le nto luhlobo lokubeka oku-yiloo nto ke, kunokwenzeka ukuba, iBolsonaro iphumile kweli lizwe ngoku, kodwa siza kubona ukuba kwenzeka ntoni ukuya phambili.
UGreg Wilpert
Ngoku, xa sijonga into anokuyenza uLula ukulwa nezi ngozi, kuthekani ngeqela lakhe, iWorkers Party, iPT? Kuthiwa uLula uyonwabela ukuthandwa ngabantu abaninzi, amaxesha amaninzi ngaphaya kweqela lakhe. Okokuqala, ngaba oko kuseyinyaniso? Abanye abantu bade bathi uphulukene neengcambu. Ngaba ikho into kwelo bali? Ukuba kunjalo, yintoni okanye iyenzile i-PT ukudibanisa nabantu abaphantsi?
UMichael Fox
Ewe, ndicinga ukuba into yokuqala, uGreg, kukuqonda nje ukuba eli phulo lonyulo elenze uLula emandleni, njengoko benditshilo, yayiyimbumba ebanzi kakhulu. Kwakungekho kunye namanye amaqela. Yayiziintshukumo zoluntu kunye neentshukumo ezisuka ezantsi. Yayibanzi kunayo nantoni na esakha sayibona ngaphambili. Ngapha koko, i-MST, isebenza kunye neminye imibutho yezentlalo, eneneni idale ezintlanu ukuya kuma-7,000 iikomiti ezahlukeneyo ezidumileyo kwiindawo zasezidolophini nakwizixeko zonke phezulu nasezantsi eBrazil ngombono waloo nto kanyeโ ukukwazi ukuququzelela unyulo lukaLula, kodwa ke ube nako. ukuqhubeka nokuququzelela kwezo ndawo kudala ngaphaya koko. Abanye abantu baye bafumana ukugxekwa malunga ne-PT ukuba baphulukene ne-grassroots, kodwa oko kugxekwa kudala kakhulu. Oku kufana, ukususela kwiminyaka elishumi edlulileyo ngexesha apho iikomiti zabo zengingqi eziphantsi zahluleka, xa i-PT yayilawula ixesha elide kakhulu.
Into esiyibonileyo ukusukela kubhukuqo-mbuso luka-Dilma Rousseff, ngakumbi ukusukela ekuvalelweni kuka-Lula, ngulo mbutho ukhwankqisayo osuka ezantsi, kwingca, kwimibutho ephantsi, ukusuka kwimibutho, imibutho, kunye nemibutho yezopolitiko emva kukaLula, emva kukaLula ukuya ku-(A) , ukumkhupha entolongweni, noku (B), ukumfaka egunyeni. Ndiyathetha, oku kufana nebali lokugqibela lokutyeba, ukubuya kwebanjwa lezopolitiko. Nanku ekhona, kwaye usanda kufika eofisini. Oku kukhulu. Abantu baseBrazil bayakuqonda oku. Ndithetha ukuthi, uLula umele abasebenzi namahlwempu.
Ndiza kukuxelela ntoni, Greg, xa ndandiseRecife, ekumntla-mpuma weBrazil, iState of Pernambuco, ngokuqinisekileyo apho uLula asuka khona, eli likomkhulu lalo. Kwakukho irally enkulu apho kuLula apho wayefike khona. Wonke umntu endathetha naye, wonke umntu wathi, โULula ngumfo wethu. ULula wandincedisa ukuya esikolweni. Wakha iiyunivesithi apho ndakwazi ukufunda khona. ULula ligorha labasebenzi.โ Ingakumbi kumntla-mpuma, uLula uphumelele olu lonyulo ngenxa yomntla-mpuma, uGreg. Uphumelele malunga ne-70% kumntla-mpuma weBrazil, ngelixa kwilizwe liphela, waphulukana okanye wayesondele kakhulu. Ke, ndithetha ukuba, abantu abaninzi babethetha kanye emva konyulo malunga nendlela umntla-mpuma weBrazil wayisindisa ngayo iBrazil. Yinyani kakhulu.
NaseSรฃo Paulo, khumbula, umkhondo kaLula unomdla kakhulu kuba wazalwa ehlwempuzekile kumntla-mpuma weBrazil. Uza emncinci eSรฃo Paulo kunye nentsapho yakhe efuna umsebenzi. Abantu abaninzi endadibana nabo kwizitrato zaseSรฃo Paulo ngobusuku awaphumelela ngabo uLula; ngobo busuku, phantse wonke umntu endathetha naye wathi, โNdiyazingca. Ndisuka ePernambuco. Ndisuka kweli lizwe. Ndisuka kumntla mpuma weBrazil. Ndilapha kuba uLula endimele.โ Ke ngokupheleleyo, usabaluleke kakhulu, ngokugqithisileyo, ethandwa kakhulu.
Ngoku, abanye abantu, ngokucacileyo, waphulukana nenkxaso ethile kuba basakholelwa ukuba wayekhohlakele okanye abakayiqondi into eyehlayo. Zonke izigwebo, zonke izityholo awayetyholwa ngazo uLula, ziye zaphoswa kwinkundla enye okanye kwenye eBrazil. Ngoko kuyahlekisa ukukholelwa ukuba ezo zigwebo zaziyinyani. Ewe kunjalo, zenziwa ngumgwebi onomkhethe uSergio Moro ngombono wokumfaka ithangi kunye nokuthintela ukukwazi kwakhe ukubuyela kumandla. Ngo-2018, uSergio Moro, ngendlela, owaba nguMphathiswa wezoBulungisa phantsi kweBolsonaro kwaye ngoku unguSenator osanda kuphumelela kwi-Senate kolunyulo lokugqibela. Uyakuthi, ndiqinisekile, akhwaze kakhulu, akhwaze kangangoko enokuba nako. Kodwa hayi, uLula ubaluleke kakhulu kubantu abaphantsi. I-grassroots ngoku ilungelelanisiwe kwaye ininzi uhlobo lomlilo kwaye inomdla kunanini ngaphambili. Yiyo loo nto olu lonyulo lwalubaluleke kakhulu. Yiyo loo nto uLula wayebaluleke kangaka.
Ke kuya kuba ngumdla ukubona ukuba baqhubeka njani ukugcina ingca ihlangene. Le yinto awathetha ngayo uJoรฃo Stedile ngaphambi nje kwevoti yomjikelo wokuqala kwinkomfa yabezindaba endandizimase eSรฃo Paulo. Ungomnye wabasunguli bexesha elide be-MST, intshukumo yabasebenzi abangenamhlaba, ngokuqinisekileyo, enye yeentshukumo ezinkulu zentlalo eMelika. Uthe, โinto esiyifunayo yintshukumo edumileyo evela ezantsi njengoko singazange siyibone kumashumi eminyaka. Bafuna nje ukutyhala uLula ngayo yonke into abanokuyenza.โ Ewe, kuya kubakho ezinye izinto ezinomdla, kuya kubakho amanye amaqela, kwaye kuya kubakho abanye abantu abazama ukutyhala uLula kumacala ahlukeneyo. Ngokucacileyo, abantu abaphantsi kufuneka bahlale belungelelene. Okwangoku, ngeli xesha, kukho umanyano oluninzi ukusuka ngaphaya kokutyhala, ngaphaya kweBolsonaro. Wonke umntu wayebeke umqolo wakhe eludongeni.
Ngoku, bendithetha nomntu izolo obandakanyeka kwintshukumo yemveli, kwaye wathi, โngoku nje, siziva izinto ezintathu. Siziva sikhululekile, siziva sichulumancile, njengokubhiyozela, isikhumbuzo, kwaye siziva sinethemba. โ Kwaye yimvakalelo esemhlabeni ngoku. Ngoku siza kubona ukuba zeziphi iinyanga ezizayo- eli lixesha lehoneymoon, kunjalo. Kwiinyanga ezizayo, izinto ziya kuba nzima ngakumbi ngendlela enye okanye enye, kwaye xa amaqela ahlukeneyo ezama ukulwela le nto okanye leya.
Okwangoku, unxibelelwano lukaLula nabantu abaphantsi kunye noququzelelo lwengca lufana nanini na ngaphambili. Umzekelo nje wokuchaza oko ngokwenene, Greg. Ngokwesiko, kwimibhiyozo yokumiselwa, ihlala ingumongameli wangaphambili ogqithisa i-sash yomongameli kumongameli ozayo. Bahamba kunye benyuka irempu kamongameli ukuya kwiPlanalto Palace, leyo, ewe, isigodlo sikamongameli, emva koko umongameli wakudala adlulisele i-sash kuLula. Ewe kunjalo, uBolsonaro wemka ngeentsuku ezimbini kwangoko, ngenxa yoko wayengadlulisi i-sash. Abantu abaninzi bebebuza, ndithetha ukuba, lo ibingumbuzo omkhulu kangangeentsuku. Kuza kwenzeka ntoni? Ngubani oza kudlulisela i-sash kuLula? Ngaba izakuba yiDilma? Ngaba izakuba ngumongameli weBolsonaro? Kuza kwenzeka ntoni? Kwaye indlela abenza ngayo yayigqibelele kakhulu, Greg. Badibanise eli qela labantu abafane bafanekisela iyantlukwano emsulwa yaseBrazil kwaye abangamaBrazilians. Ubunompheki. Ubunomqokeleli wenkunkuma omnyama ophuma kusapho lwe [foreign language 00:33:17] kunye nabahlaziyi ezitratweni. Ubunomlweli okhubazekileyo-umntu osuka kuluntu lwe-LGBT. Ubunomntwana omncinci, umntwana oneminyaka elishumi ubudala, umntwana omnyama, kwaye badibana bonke. Owu, kwaye kunjalo, uNkosi uRaoni, eyona nkokeli ibalulekileyo kwimbali yaseBrazil. Ungumfana owenza zonke iikhenkethi emva ngeminyaka yee-'80s kunye no-Sting kwaye ngokwenene wayegxeka kakhulu kulawulo lwe-Dilma Rousseff emva ekuqaleni kwe-2010s. Bonke benyuka benyuka irempu kamongameli kunye, bebambene ngengalo, baza bafaka ibhanti likamongameli kuLula. Loo nto ibonakalisa nje ngokucacileyo ukuba lo uzakuba ngurhulumente, okanye uLula ufuna lo ibe ngurhulumente wabantu nowabantu, apho abantu banika uLula igunya lokulawula. Uzakuzama ukubambelela koko ukuze aqiniseke ukuba uyakwazi ukutyhala, aqhubeke nokutyhala imigaqo-nkqubo yakhe.
Enye yezinto esizivileyo kuSonia Guajajara, umzekelo, ngoku unguMphathiswa wabantu boMthonyama. Uthe kwincoko yakhe yokuqala nabalandeli bakhe ukuba ebencokola ngalo lonke ixesha ngeli phulo noLula. Uhlala ethetha, "heyi, kuqhubeka ntoni?" Bazibona kwiindawo ezahlukeneyo. Bahlala bethetha ngezinto abazifunayo. Emva koko waba nguye owathi, "masenze iSebe lezabantu bomthonyama, masenze." Kwiintsuku ezimbalwa emva koko, uLula uthetha ngaloo nto ehla enyuka elizweni. Uyenzile. Wasifezekisa isithembiso sakhe. Nanko ke. Usemandleni. Ngoko abantu bomthonyama bachulumancile ngakumbi kunangaphambili. Abantu phezulu naphantsi kweli lizwe bachulumancile ngakumbi kunangaphambili. Kukho ithemba okokuqala kwixesha elide kakhulu.
UGreg Wilpert
Kulungile, ke, kweli nqaku, siza kulishiya apho okwangoku. Bendithetha noMichael Fox, intatheli ezimeleyo, umamkeli, kunye nomvelisi wepodcast Brazil on Fire. Enkosi kwakhona, Mike, ngokundidibanisa nam namhlanje.
UMichael Fox
Enkosi kakhulu, Greg. Kumnandi ukuba lapha.
UGreg Wilpert
Enkosi kubaphulaphuli bethu ngokujoyina Ihlabathi liyatsha. Ukufana kwesihloko kwipodcast kaMike yinto nje eyenzeka ngebhaqo. Enkosi kwakhona.
I-ZNetwork ixhaswa ngemali kuphela ngesisa sabafundi bayo.
Nikela