Ku-COP23, i-International Energy Agency ibikezela ukuthi ukukhiqizwa kukawoyela wase-US kulindeleke ukuthi kukhule ngezinga elingenakuqhathaniswa eminyakeni ezayo—njengoba iningi lososayensi emhlabeni wonke lithi amazwe adinga ukunciphisa ukukhishwa kukawoyela, hhayi ukukusheshisa. Khonamanjalo, iqembu lososayensi abayizi-15,000 lihlangene ukuze likhiphe “isaziso sesibili” esibi esintwini, eminyakeni engama-25 ngemuva kokuba iqembu lososayensi likhiphe “isaziso sokuqala” esixwayisa umhlaba wonke ngokushintsha kwesimo sezulu. Sikhuluma nombhali-mbisene walo mbiko, u-Kevin Anderson, ongomunye wososayensi bezulu abahamba phambili emhlabeni. U-Anderson uyisekela lomqondisi we-Tyndall Center for Climate Change Research kanye noprofesa wezamandla nokushintsha kwesimo sezulu e-University of Manchester eBrithani. Lo mbiko unesihloko esithi “Ingabe Isimo Sezulu Singakwazi Ukukhokhela Ukulutha Kwegesi YaseYurophu?”
AMY U-GOODMAN: Lokhu Intando yeningi Manje!, democracynow.org. Ngingu-Amy Goodman. Sisakaza bukhoma engqungqutheleni yesimo sezulu ye-UN e-Bonn, eJalimane. I-International Energy Agency ibikezela ukuthi ukukhiqizwa kukawoyela e-US kulindeleke ukuthi kukhule ngezinga elingenakuqhathaniswa eminyakeni ezayo, njengoba iningi lososayensi emhlabeni wonke lithi amazwe kumele anciphise ukumba kukawoyela, hhayi ukukusheshisa. Khonamanjalo, iqembu lososayensi abayizi-15,000 lihlangene ukuze likhiphe “isaziso sesibili” esibi esintwini, eminyakeni engama-25 ngemuva kokuba iqembu lososayensi likhiphe “isaziso sokuqala” esixwayisa umhlaba wonke ngokushintsha kwesimo sezulu.
Lokhu kuza njengokusha okukhulu cwaningo uthi ohulumeni base-Europe bakuthathe kancane ukukhishwa kwe-methane ephuma kugesi. Lo mbiko uthola ukuthi amazwe e-European Union angashisa igesi nezinye izinto ezimbiwa phansi ngesilinganiso samanje iminyaka eyisishiyagalolunye kuphela ngaphambi kokuba la mazwe aqede isabelo sawo sebhajethi ye-carbon esele edingekayo ukuze izinga lokushisa libe ngaphansi kuka-2 degrees Celsius, noma u-3.6 degrees Fahrenheit. .
Hhayi-ke, manje sesijoyinwa omunye umbhali walowo mbiko, omunye wososayensi besimo sezulu abahamba phambili emhlabeni. Wahamba lapha esuka eNgilandi ngesitimela, wenqaba ukundiza ngenxa yobukhulu bayo bekhabhoni. U-Kevin Anderson uyisekela lomqondisi we-Tyndall Center for Climate Change Research kanye noprofesa wezamandla nokushintsha kwesimo sezulu eNyuvesi yaseManchester eBrithani, umlobi ongumhlanganyeli wombiko omusha omkhulu onesihloko esithi “Ingabe Isimo Sezulu Singakwazi Ukukhokhela Ukulutha Kwegesi YaseYurophu?”
Kevin Anderson, wamukelekile futhi Intando yeningi Manje! Kumnandi ukuba nawe. Ngakho-ke, kuningi ongakhuluma ngakho. Okokuqala, uthathe isitimela lapha, hhayi indiza?
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Yebo. Ngizama njalo ukuhamba ngesitimela noma ngomkhumbi, ngokuvamile ngomkhumbi wamabhokisi. Akukhona ukuthi ngicabanga ukuthi ukukhishwa okuvela kimi noma komunye umuntu, ngokwako, kubaluleke kakhulu. Kepha ngicabanga ukuthi kudingekile ngempela, kithina esahlulela ukuthi ukuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu kuyindaba enkulu futhi ebucayi, ukuthi sikukhombise lokho ezimpilweni zethu, nokuthi asikukhombisi nje kulokho esikwenzayo, kodwa uyazama. futhi siphushe leyo ajenda kabanzi, phakathi kozakwethu, namanyuvesi ethu, bese, kunjalo, ngethemba, ekugcineni, ukuthi ohulumeni bazithathele lezi zinto bese bekhuphula izinqubomgomo ukuze baqhubekisele phambili lolu shintsho lokuziphatha ezweni lonke bese, ngethemba. , izinga lomhlaba wonke.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Usungule igama elithi “the climate glitterti.” Usho ukuthini?
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Ngicabanga ukuthi kube khona-iminyaka eminingi, bekukhona abantu, uyazi, abakhulu nabahle, emhlabeni wesimo sezulu. Futhi ngokuqinisekile baye bazama kanzima ukubhekana nenkinga yokushintsha kwesimo sezulu, nakuba ngicabanga, ngedatha yakamuva, singabona ukuthi ukukhishwa kwegesi kukhuphuka, ngisho nakulo nyaka, ngo-2017. Ngakho, ngokuyisisekelo, bona kanye nathi sonke. empeleni sehlulekile ukuletha lokho ebesikulindele noma ebesikulindele.
Kodwa leli qembu, ngicabanga, lenze kahle ngokuphawulekayo emhlabeni wokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu, uma uthanda, kukho konke lokhu, ama-COP noma izingxoxo, ukusebenzelana nabakhi benqubomgomo, uhambo oluya eDavos nokunye. Futhi ngicabanga, ekwenzeni lokho, ekubeni yingxenye ye isimo sezwe samanje, empeleni abaqondanga ukuthi ingxenye ebalulekile yenkinga uma kuziwa ekushintsheni kwesimo sezulu yenza izinguquko endleleni esiphila ngayo ukuphila kwethu namuhla, ikakhulukazi thina esingabantu abakhipha umoya ophakeme kakhulu. Cishe amaphesenti angama-50 okukhishwa kwegesi emhlabeni wonke asanda kuvela cishe kumaphesenti ayishumi omphakathi womhlaba. Futhi ukucwazimula kwesimo sezulu kucace bha—futhi ngizifaka lapho—kulelo qembu. Futhi kufanele sikhombise ubuholi kwesikwenzayo. Futhi ngicabanga ukuthi uma abantu bezothatha ukuhlaziya kwethu ngokucophelela, kufanele sikuboleke lokho kuhlaziya ngokubonisa ukuthi silungisa izimpilo zethu ngokufanele.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Uthathe izithombe zengqungquthela ngoLwesihlanu ebusuku?
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Yebo, ngikwenzile ngempela, yebo. Yebo, bengilapha ngo-10:00, ngenkathi kungenalutho. Ngangisasebenza kwelinye lamaqoqo ekhompyutha. Futhi zonke izikrini zekhompyutha zazisavuliwe. Kodwa izikrini ezinkulu ezinkulu zazisasebenza. Futhi lena yingqungquthela yokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu, ingqungquthela yesi-23 yokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu. Manje, ngivumelana ne- I-UNFCCC futhi IPCC nalezi zinhlangano ezinkulu. Zibaluleke ngempela futhi zibalulekile ekuguqukeni kwesimo sezulu. Kodwa kufanele, impela, manje, sibonisa ushintsho ezikhungweni zethu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Bengikhuluma namanye amaqhawe asePacific namhlanje ekuseni, ngesikhathi egingqa umata obomvu othi “Wugcine phansi,” ku-Angela Merkel, okhuluma namuhla. Babevela eTonga naseSamoa. Bathe kuseFiji ngaphakathi kanti iBonn ingaphandle, amakhaza ashubisa umnkantsha ngaphandle futhi ayabila ngaphakathi.
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Yebo, lokho kufana kakhulu. Yebo, impela, yebo. Iphinde ikhanye kakhulu ngaphakathi, futhi, nawo wonke amalambu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ngakho-ke, ungakhuluma ngalokho okwashiwo nguDavid Banks? Lona ngumeluleki kaMongameli Trump ngesimo sezulu.
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Hhayi-ke, ukuthatha kwami kulokho engikuzwile lapho kwakungakhululekile kakhulu ezama ukuvikela okungenakuvinjelwa, ngempela. Ngiqonde ukuthi, kuyacaca ukuthi akaneme ngokuthi kumele avumelane nokushiwo ngumengameli izikhathi eziningi mayelana nokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu. Yebo, isikhundla sakhe—izikhundla zikamongameli zishintshe kakhulu kulokhu, njengoba senzile nakwezinye izindawo.
Ngiqonde ukuthi, ngicabanga, ekugcineni kosuku, ukuthi ngokusobala umongameli kanye nomeluleki wakhe bayanqikaza ukuzibandakanya nanoma yini evela kwisayensi yokuguquka kwesimo sezulu. Ngakho-ke beza ekushintsheni kwesimo sezulu ngombono ohluke ngokuphelele, futhi isayensi icishe ibe yinto engasho lutho. Bacabanga ngokushintsha kwesimo sezulu kakhulu esikhathini esifushane, esincane, sopolitiki.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ngakho-ke, ube nephaneli likaTrump ngoMsombuluko ebusuku. Kwakumangaza nje. Izingxenye ezintathu kwezine zekamelo zaphuma phakathi, zacula iculo elithi, “Proud to Be an American,” kwelinye isosha esihlatshelelwayo. Futhi ekugcineni kwaleli phaneli—kwakuyizikhulu ezine zezinkampani kanye nothile ovela ehhovisi likaPence nehhovisi likaTrump—ngathola ithuba lokubabuza umbuzo.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ngingu-Amy Goodman wase- Intando yeningi Manje! ihora lezindaba.
I-FRANCIS UBROOKE: Kulungile, lona ngu—lona ngowethu—lo ngumbuzo wethu wokugcina ngaphambi kokuba siwugoqe.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Umbuzo osheshayo, u-yebo nje noma cha ovela komunye nomunye wenu: ngabe niyameseka yini uMongameli uTrump ekhipha i-US esivumelwaneni sesimo sezulu saseParis? Uma singaqala ngoLenka?
LENKA I-KOLLAR: Ngilapha ngesizathu, futhi lokho ngeseseka ukunqanda ukuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Impendulo esheshayo, elula ethi yebo-noma-cha.
LENKA I-KOLLAR: Umbuzo wawuwukuthi?
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ukuthi uyameseka uMongameli uTrump ukuthi akhiphe i-United States esivumelwaneni sesimo sezulu saseParis?
LENKA I-KOLLAR: Cha, angikusekeli.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Holly?
NGCWELE I-KRUTKA: Ngiyazi ukuthi ufuna u-yebo noma cha, kodwa isitatimende senkampani yethu bekungeyena uyebo noma cha, ngakho ngicela ungivumele ngisho ukuthi siyini. Asizange silinganisele. Empeleni, kwakukhona imibiko esikala ngayo nhlangothi zombili. Umbono wethu bekuwukuthi kuya kubo. Kuningi okumele unqume. Kodwa noma ngabe i-US isesivumelwaneni sesimo sezulu saseParis noma cha, sizoqhubeka nokusebenza kubuchwepheshe obukhipha umoya omncane wamalahle.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Futhi wena, uqobo, Holly?
NGCWELE I-KRUTKA: Gosh, empeleni angiyena umuntu wenqubomgomo. Uxolo, lokho bekuyiphoyisa. Uqinisile. Mina, ngokwami—angizile ukuzozimela, ngakho woza ukhulume nami ngemva kwalokho.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Yebo noma cha, uyamela noma uyaphikisana?
NGCWELE I-KRUTKA: Ngeke ngiphendule ngombono wami siqu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: U-Amose?
I-AMOS I-HOCHSTEIN: Ngicabanga ukuthi nginomsebenzi olula kunawo wonke. Angicabangi ukuthi uDave noma uFrancis abalindele ukuthi ngikhulume okunye. Ngisebenzele abaphathi baka-Obama. Ngeseka Isivumelwano SaseParis ngokugcwele, ngacabanga ukuthi kwakuyimpumelelo enkulu kamongameli.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Barry Worthington, yebo noma cha?
IBHALISI I-WORTHINGTON: Empeleni kunezimpendulo ezimbili.
Izithameli MEMBER: Yebo noma cha!
IBHALISI I-WORTHINGTON: I-US Energy Association ayizange ithathe isikhundla ngaphambi kokuthi umongameli aphume eParis. Ngokushesha nje lapho ephuma eParis, sakhipha isitatimende sokuthi kufanele axoxisane kabusha neParis. Ngokombono wami siqu, impendulo inguyebo, ngenxa yezizathu engizibekile. Si-
AMY U-GOODMAN: Usekela uTrump ukuthi akhiphe i-United States.
IBHALISI I-WORTHINGTON: Sifinyelela imigomo yokunciphisa ukukhishwa kwekhabhoni ngaphandle kokuba nomthwalo wokulawula. Sikwenza ngenxa yezinye izizathu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: UFrancis Brooke?
I-FRANCIS UBROOKE: Ngiyabonga, Barry. Manje sesizovala izipikha zethu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Cha, Francis, ngingathanda impendulo yakho.
I-FRANCIS UBROOKE: Ungakwazi yini—asikho lapha—
AMY U-GOODMAN: Abantu ababili nje ngaphezulu, umbuzo olula, yebo noma cha.
Izithameli AMALUNGU: Kuthatha imizuzwana emihlanu! Mphendule! Yiphendule!
I-FRANCIS UBROOKE: Ngiqonde ukuthi, ngokusobala, sobabili sisebenzela abaphathi, ngakho-ke yilokho esilapha ukuzomela, futhi ngeke kushintshe lutho. Ngakho-ke sesizokwenza ukuvala manje.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Futhi, David Banks, umbuzo wakho-wokugcina.
I-FRANCIS UBROOKE: Ngakho-ke sizoqala ngo-Barry Worthington.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Yebo noma cha?
I-FRANCIS UBROOKE: Uzosivala.
Izithameli MEMBER: David, iyiphi impendulo?
DAVID Amabhange: Ngisebenzela umongameli wase-United States.
Izithameli MEMBER: Ngakho ingabe uyebo noma cha?
AMY U-GOODMAN: Lowo kwakungumeluleki kaTrump ngesimo sezulu, uDavid Banks; ngaphambi kwalokho, uFrancis Brooke, umsizi wenqubomgomo eHhovisi lePhini likaMongameli uPence. Kulaba abamele izinkampani ezine ezicindezela inuzi, igesi namalahle, uLenka Kollar weNuScale energy kanye no-Amos Hochstein waseTellurian abavumelani noTrump ekhipha i-US esivumelwaneni sezulu. UHolly Krutka wePeabody ubengeke asho. NoBarry Worthington we-US Energy Association uvumelane noMongameli uTrump. Kuyathakazelisa ukuthi uTrump uletha—ukuphatha kukaTrump kuletha abaphathi bezinkampani ezine; ababili babo—ingxenye yabo—abavumelani naye kulolu daba. Kodwa impendulo yakho kulokho abakushoyo?
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Futhi, ngicabanga ukuthi ngokuyinhloko bazama nje ukuthatha umugqa wezepolitiki kulokhu. Ababona—ababonakali bebambene kakhulu nezindaba zokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu ezikhona. Ababoni—ngithola umbono wokuthi babengakuboni njengendaba engathi sína ngempela, ukuthi kwakumane kuyiva kubo. Babengakhululekile ukuzama ukuvikela isikhundla esisodwa noma esinye.
Uyazi, ngokwezinga elithile, ngicabanga ukuthi kusikhumbuza lokho esikubonile kubaphathi bakaTrump: ukungaqiniseki okuningi futhi akukho ukucaca futhi, ngingaphinda ngiphikise, ngicabanga, ukuntuleka okuphelele kokucabanga okusha. Ngoba uma bekhathazeke ngokweqiniso ngezinhlobo zezinto uTrump athe ukhathazekile ngazo, izinto ezifana nemisebenzi, ngicabanga ukuthi i-ajenda yokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu ingachazwa kalula njenge-ajenda yemisebenzi. Ngakho-ke kunomsebenzi omningi ekuphenduleni inselele yesimo sezulu ngokuhambisana neSivumelwano saseParis. Kodwa kudinga ukucabanga okusha okuthe xaxa. angizwanga—
AMY U-GOODMAN: Yimiphi leyo misebenzi?
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Hhayi-ke, uma ucabanga ngakho, imboni evuselelekayo ngokwayo idinga abantu abaningi abasebenza kuyo. Kodwa futhi, kufanele sibuyisele ingqalasizinda ekhona esinayo emphakathini wethu. Uma ubheka i-US, isetshenziswa kakhulu amandla. Lokho kudinga ukushintsha ngokushesha. Lokho kusho ukulungisa kabusha izakhiwo nezakhiwo, izindlu zabantu. Kusho ukufakwa kukagesi okukhulu kakhulu ohlelweni lwamandla kunalokho esikubona namuhla. Kukhona nje inani elikhulu lomsebenzi wokwakha, umsebenzi wobunjiniyela, umsebenzi wokuklama. Uyazi, lokhu kumayelana nohlelo lwemisebenzi yeminyaka engama-30 lazo zonke izingxenye zomhlaba ezinezimboni ukuya ekushintsheni kusuka engqalasizinda enekhabhoni ephezulu kakhulu esinayo manje kuya engqalasizinda yekhabhoni ephansi yakusasa. Ngakho-ke, ngalowo mqondo, impela, uma ukuzibophezela kwakhe ku-Dust Belt bekuqotho futhi enekhono lokusungula izinto ezintsha, ubezobona ukuthi i-ajenda yokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu iwuhlelo lwemisebenzi kubantu abamvotele.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Imicabango yakho nge-geoengineering, into okuxoxwa ngayo lapha? Okokuqala, kusho ukuthini nokuthi ucabangani ngakho?
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Hhayi-ke, ake sicacise. Kukhona i-geoengineering, futhi kukhona okunye okufana ncamashi nalokho okubizwa ngokuthi yi-negative emission technologies. Ubuchwepheshe be-negative emission ngokuyisisekelo yibo lobu buchwepheshe esingakabi nabo, obuklanywe—noma okuthenjwa ukuthi esikhathini esizayo buzosusa isikhutha ngokuqondile emkhathini, uhlobo lokumunca isikhutha emkhathini. Futhi okungenani lokho kubhekana nenkinga yangempela, noma singenabo lobu buchwepheshe. Bese uncibilikisa leyo carbon dioxide bese uyigcina endaweni ethile ngokuphephile ngaphansi komhlaba iminyaka eyizinkulungwane ezimbalwa noma ezimbalwa. I-geoengineering i-
AMY U-GOODMAN: Uyakusekela noma uyaphikisana nalokho?
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Ngingowethu ukuthi siyicwaninge, kodwa ngingowethu ukuthi senze konke ukunciphisa, konke ukuncishiswa kwekhabhoni, sicabanga ukuthi akusebenzi. Ngakho-ke, yebo ukucwaninga, cha ukukufaka ezinqubweni zethu namuhla.
Futhi i-geoengineering empeleni, ngicabanga, iyingozi kakhulu, ezicini eziningi, noma kunjalo, futhi, ngicabanga ukuthi kubalulekile ukuba nohlelo locwaningo kuyo. Kodwa i-geoengineering ithi, “Masingakwenzi okuningi kangako ekunciphiseni. Masithembele ekubuyiseleni ukukhanya kwelanga—ukukhanya kwelanga nokushisa kubuyisele emkhathini, ngakho-ke singayixazulula ngaleyo ndlela inkinga.” Futhi ziyizinto ezifana nokumpompa ama-sulfate ku-stratosphere, amarokhethi ku-stratosphere ukuze abeke ama-sulfate lapho. Babeka-ukucebisa ezinye zezilwandle nge-iron ukwandisa ukumuncwa-ukuthuthukiswa kwe-biomass, emunca i-carbon dioxide emkhathini. Kodwa zonke lezi zinto ziphazamisa uhlobo lwezinhlelo ezinkulu zeplanethi yethu esingaziqondi ngokugcwele. Ngicabanga ukuthi ziyingozi ngendlela emangalisayo. Kodwa noma kunjalo, ngicabanga ukuthi kubalulekile ukucwaninga lezo, kodwa, futhi, ukunciphisa ukukhishwa kwethu, ukunciphisa ukukhishwa kwethu, sicabange ukuthi ngeke zisebenze, futhi.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ekugcineni, imuphi umphumela uMongameli uTrump ethi ukhipha i-US esivumelwaneni sezulu? Ubugxeka isivumelwano sezulu. Futhi sinemizuzwana engu-20 yale ngxenye yengxoxo yethu, bese sizokwenza Ingxenye 2.
UKEVIN U-AndERSON: Kukhona okuhle, futhi kukhona ingxenye embi. Ukukhipha kuthumela isignali embi ngempela. Kepha ekuphumeni kwakhe, kunikeze amandla ezinye izingxenye zomhlaba ukuthi zithi, “Sizongenela senze okungaphezulu kakhulu,” okuhlanganisa, vele, izimeya eziningi zaseMelika.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Sikhuluma no-Kevin Anderson, uprofesa weZennström kwezobuholi bokuguquguquka kwesimo sezulu eSikhungweni Sezemvelo Nezifundo Zokuthuthukiswa, i-Uppsala University, ophinde abe ngusihlalo wamandla nokushintsha kwesimo sezulu e-Tyndall Center for Climate Change Research eNyuvesi yaseManchester eBrithani. Sizoxhuma ku- umbiko ukuthi ubhale ngokuhlanganyela.
I-ZNetwork ixhaswa kuphela ngokuphana kwabafundi bayo.
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