Zeynep Bilgehan: Mwatulutsa uthenga wa mgwirizano kwa otsutsa ochokera ku Ankara. Choyamba mwakhala nthawi yayitali bwanji ku Ankara ndipo cholinga chaulendo wanu ndi chiyani?

Tariq Ali: Ndinali ku Ankara kwa masiku atatu kuti ndikapereke nkhani yapagulu poyitanidwa ndi masepala a Cankaya omwe adagwirizana miyezi ingapo yapitayo. Mwachibadwa ndinkaona zimene zinkachitika madzulo. Kuwukira kosavomerezeka kwa owonetsa mwamtendere, kugwiritsa ntchito utsi wokhetsa misozi ndi madzi mosalekeza kunayendera Park ndikulankhula ndi achinyamata kumeneko.

ZB: Mukuganiza bwanji pazochitika zonse zaposachedwapa? M'malingaliro anu zomwe zidachitika kapena zikuchitika ku Turkey?

Tariq Ali: Kusakaniza kwa luntha lakuthwa, kusachita mantha ndi kubadwanso kwa chiyembekezo komwe ndidawona kunali kolimbikitsa kwambiri. Zinandikumbutsa kumlingo wina wa ku Europe (Paris ndi Prague) mu 1968, kuposa masika achiarabu. Zomwe zikuchitika ku Turkey ndizomveka bwino. Boma laulamuliro losankhidwa, lodzipereka ku neo-liberalisam ndi nkhondo, linkaganiza kuti lingachite chilichonse chomwe likufuna chifukwa cha demokalase yake. Uku kunali kulakwitsa kopusa.

Ndili ku Istanbul miyezi ingapo yapitayo, zinali zovuta kuti ndisazindikire kupsinjika komwe kudakhudza olimbikitsa komanso otsutsa. Kutsekedwa kwa kanema wina wakale kwambiri mumzinda wa Istiklal kudadzetsa ziwonetsero zofatsa. Chofatsa kwambiri kotero kuti boma linaganiza kuti likhoza kufulumizitsa ntchito yomwe yasankha ndi kuwononga ntchitoyo. Iwo analakwitsa molakwika. Prime Minister, makamaka, Sultan weniweni wamakampani omanga adakana kuthawa ndikuyamba kupondereza. Uku kunali kusweka. Anthu osakhudzidwa ndi kuwonongedwa kwa Gezi tsopano adabwera kudzatsutsa komanso mwaunyinji. Kuponderezako kunkakula kwambiri, m’pamenenso zionetserozo zinakula kwambiri, zikufalikira pafupifupi m’dziko lonselo kupatula matawuni anayi olamulidwa ndi Akurdi. Kampeni yopulumutsa malo osungiramo nyama inasanduka chiwembu cha dziko lotsutsa boma louma khosi ndi lachiwembu.

ZB: Mukuti, otsutsa aku Turkey adayatsa chiyembekezo ku Europe. Kodi iwo anayatsa chiyembekezo m’lingaliro lotani?

Tariq Ali: M'lingaliro lakuti zomwe zikuchitika ku Turkey ndi gawo la zovuta za neo-liberal capitalism. Ku Spain, Greece, Portugal pakhala ziwonetsero zambiri, ziwonetsero, ndi zina zotero. Ngakhale Erdogan ankagwiritsa ntchito makina opondereza a boma kuti apititse patsogolo ntchito yomanga, mgwirizano wachi Greek unatseka TV ndi wailesi ya boma kuti achotse atolankhani. Anthu olimba mtima a ku Turkey adatsegula njira yatsopano panthawi yofunika kwambiri. Ndipo chitsanzo chawo chitha kufalikira ku France ndipo, ndani akudziwa, mwina Britain ndi Germany m'miyezi ikubwerayi.

ZB: Mukuganiza kuti zotsatira za zionetserozi zidzakhala zotani?

Tariq Ali: Chofunikira monga ndidanenera muuthenga wanga wamgwirizano ndikuti boma ladziyimitsa mothandizidwa ndi atolankhani aku Turkey omwe adanyalanyaza, kunyoza komanso kunyoza omwe adakhala ku Taksim m'masabata oyamba. Atolankhani omwe adagwirizana ayenera kupachika manja awo manyazi. Ponena za momwe otsutsa atsopanowo akugwirizanitsa ndizovuta kunena. Koma ngati gulu latsopano la ndale lokhazikitsidwa mwa demokalase likhazikitsidwa (monga, mwachitsanzo, Syriza ku Greece) litha kupereka mawu okhazikika kwa anthu ochokera pansi. Msonkhano wapagulu wapamwezi ku Istanbul, Ankara, Izmir, Bodrum, Antakiyya ndi mizinda ina kuti akambirane momwe zinthu ziliri kunyumba ndi kunja ndikupereka lipoti lomanga gulu latsopanoli lingapangitse chinthu chosatha ndikupangitsa kuyeretsa ndi kukonzanso mabwalo. pang'ono zopanda tanthauzo. Ichi ndi chiyembekezo changa.

ZB: Muuthenga wanu mumatchula mwachidule kuti 'Popita nthawi yaitali ndale za ku Turkey zidzasinthidwa' Kodi mungafotokoze izi? Kodi chidzachitike n'chiyani? Kodi Turkey idzasintha bwanji?

Tariq Ali: Turkey yasintha. Izi zikuonekera bwino ndi zimene tikuona. Monga ndanenera pamwambapa chinsinsi tsopano ndi momwe mungakhazikitsire kusintha kumeneku kuti demokalase ya Turkey ipitirire. Demokalase Yeniyeni mosiyana ndi demokalase yomwe ilipo kwenikweni ndi duwa losakhwima. Iyenera kukulitsidwa ndikukulitsidwa koma osati ndi magazi a nzika zake kapena kuyang'aniridwa nthawi zonse (zokumbukira, koma mwaukadaulo pamlingo wapamwamba kwambiri komanso wonyozeka kwambiri kuposa momwe Stasi wakale waku East Germany adamwalira) kapena ma drones ndi kuzunza kapena kutsekera m’ndende anthu amene amalankhula zoona. Neo-liberal capitalism ikusokoneza demokalase. Iwo omwe amalimbana ndi chiwembu cha capitalist akulimbitsanso demokalase.

ZB: M’mafunso athu apitawa tidakambiranapo za Arab Spring. Munati “Kasupe wasanduka dzinja”. Kodi mungafananize zomwe zikuchitika ku Turkey ndi Arab Spring? Zofanana ndi chiyani ndipo zimasiyana bwanji?

Tariq Ali: Kufananako kuli pamlingo wa zipolowe, koma apo ayi zinthu nzosiyana. Monga ndanenera kale kuti Turkey mu moyo wake waluntha ndi chikhalidwe chake ndale ali pafupi kwambiri ndi Europe. Mmodzi ayenera kungoyang'ana mabuku omasuliridwa kuchokera ku zilankhulo za ku Ulaya, ku yunivesite ndi maphunziro a sukulu, ndi zina zotero kuti azindikire izi ndi kalembedwe ndi chibadwa cha owonetsera zimatsimikizira zonsezi, osachepera, mwa lingaliro langa. Maulamuliro opondereza ankhondo akhalapo ku Spain, Portugal, Greece ndi Turkey. Munthawi yamakono pomwe dziko la United States lachoka ku maulamuliro ankhanza m'maiko omwe amakasitomala, dziko la Turkey lapindula. Koma boma latsopanoli, makamaka, Prime Minister wozunza akuganiza kuti atha kulamulira mwanjira yakale. Ntchito ya Erdogan ndikudzimanga yekha ngati anti-Ataturk pogwiritsa ntchito chinenero cha NATO mu chovala cha Islam 'chochepa'. Tawona 'kudziletsa' m'masabata aposachedwa. Lingaliro lakuti Islamist conservatism ikhoza kuthetsa mavuto enieni ndi Turkey monga chitsanzo tsopano ikuwoneka ngati nthabwala odwala ku Turkey, kusiya Egypt ndi Tunisia.

ZB: Kodi tingatchule kuti gululi ndi Turkey Spring? Chifukwa chiyani?

Tariq Ali: Bwanji mukuvutikira kugwiritsa ntchito mawuwa. Zawawasa kale.

ZB: Mpata uliwonse kuyenda kumeneku kudzakhalanso nyengo yozizira? Kodi tiyenera kuchita chiyani kuti izi zitheke?

Tariq Ali: Mbiri imaphunzitsa kuti n'zosatheka kusunga kayendedwe kameneka kwamuyaya. Choncho munthu sayenera kuvomereza n’komwe zimenezi. Funso lenileni ndi momwe mungapitire patsogolo pambuyo pa gawo loyamba. Ndipo apa ndapanga malingaliro angapo kale. Bungwe kuchokera pansi kuti mupange ndale zatsopano. Gulu lalikulu ndi logwirizana lidzafuna nsanja yandale, zomwe zingathe kumenyedwa zaka zamtsogolo.

ZB: Kodi gululi lidzakhudza bwanji Middle East?

Tariq Ali: Pamene Ofesi Yachilendo Yachilendo ku Syria posachedwapa idalangiza nzika zake kuti zisapite ku Turkey chifukwa cha chipwirikiti ndi kuponderezedwa, uku kunali kunyoza mwalamulo ndipo kuyankha funso lanu. Ku Ankara, chipembedzo cha Erdogan chinandikumbutsa pang'ono za Mubarek ndi Assad.

ZB: Pomaliza mu uthenga wanu mumanena kuti “Yambanipo kuchepetsa zomwe mukuchita koma khalani pamodzi kusonyeza kuti mukadalipo”. Kodi mungafotokoze bwino izi? Ochita zionetserozi apitilize bwanji?

Tariq Ali: Zomwe ndimatanthawuza ndikuti nthawi zonse ndibwino kuti gululi lisankhe kubwerera kwakanthawi komwe sikwandale koma mwanzeru.

ZB: Mukuganiza kuti gulu la ndale lingabwere pamenepa? Zikuyenera kuchitika kapena gululi likhalebe ngati kukana anthu?

Tariq Ali: Monga ndanenera pamwambapa, kubadwa kwa gulu latsopano landale kungakhale njira yabwino kwambiri yopitira patsogolo. Dziko la Turkey ndi dziko lopanda kutsutsa kwenikweni popeza onse achisilamu okhazikika komanso okonda dziko lawo amavomerezana pa neo-liberalism, pa NATO, pa kulamulira kolimba kwa atolankhani, kumanga olemba nkhani (Turkey ali ndi ndondomeko ya golide kutsogolo uku), ndi zina zotero. pali vacuum. Nthawi ndi yabwino. Demagogy ya Erdogan yasokoneza anzake ena.

Okhazikika pazachikhalidwe, osagwirizana ndi ndale, akuwoneka mwachuma m'mafakitale apadera komanso achisilamu omwe amawakonda kwambiri ankhondo a NATO, chipani champhamvu chidanyalanyaza mawu pamsewu. Zoonadi zomwe zikufuulidwa m'mizinda ingapo zitha kukhala zosasangalatsa boma koma ndizofunikira kwambiri kuposa zomwe olemba nkhani zamalonda, ma TV atolankhani ovomerezeka. Ndipo chirichonse chimene chinachitikira 'anzeru' 60 osankhidwa ndi boma. Kodi chikumbumtima chawo chonse chafa?

Kuyankhulana uku kunachitika ndi Zeynep Bilgehan pa 18th June pa pepala la Turkey Hürriyet.

Tariq Ali ndi mlembi wa Obama Syndrome (Zomwe). 

---