Ingxoxo kuvidiyo ingabonwa lapha
Iningi lamaJuda aseYurophu abalekela amaNazi lalizofuna ukuthuthela eNyakatho Melika kodwa iminyango yavalwa. "Umqondo wokwakha izwe elinjalo ezweni elingelona izwe elingenalutho, kude naso, ngokulahlekelwa abantu bendawo wawutshala imbewu yenhlekelele esele ineminyaka engamashumi ambalwa kusukela ngo-1947/1948." , kusho u-Achcar. Ngemuva kokudliwa ngokuphelele kwePalestine ngemuva kweMpi Yezinsuku Eziyisithupha ngo-1967 u-Israel ubelokhu enqaba noma yisiphi isivumelwano samazwe ngamazwe "somhlaba ukuze kube nokuthula". Ukukhishwa okuphelele kuka-Israyeli kuzo zonke izindawo ezathathwa ngo-1967 kanye nokuhlonishwa kwelungelo lamaPalestine lokuzibusa okungenani kumaphesenti angama-22 wendawo yawo yomlando kungaba yisimo esincane sanoma yisiphi isixazululo sokuthula. Kubalulekile futhi ukulamula "empini yokulandisa" phakathi kwencazelo yeZionist kanye neColonialist yengxabano, kusho u-Achcar.
UGilbert Achcar: Usosayensi Wezombangazwe kanye Nesazi Sezenhlalakahle "Esikoleni Sezifundo ZaseMpumalanga Nezase-Afrika", iNyuvesi yaseLondon, Isishoshovu Sokuthula, Umbhali we "The Arabs and Holocaust" kanye noNoam Chomsky "Perilous Power"
UDavid Goessmann: Kuningi okubikwayo mayelana nokungqubuzana kwe-Israel-Palestine kwabezindaba zaseNtshonalanga. Bakuchaza njengokufa okubulalayo, umjikelezo wobudlova. Kodwa abavamile ukuhlinzeka ngezimo ezibalulekile njengokuthi kungani i-UN Resolution 242 kusukela ngo-1967 kanye nokunye okuvunyelwene ngamazwe ngamazwe mayelana nokuxazulula ukuthula kungeke kusetshenziswe. Siphe ukuqonda kokuthi kungani bungekho ubulungisa nokuthula kwa-Israel nasePalestine nokuthi yini okufanele yenziwe ukufeza lokho.
UGilbert Achcar: Angicabangi ukuthi kukhona okubulalayo kulokhu okwenzekayo, ngendlela yokuthi okwenzeka emashumini amane eminyaka manje, kuwumphumela wezinqumo zokuziphatha kwebutho elithile lezombusazwe, eliqhuba okwenzeka ngasohlangothini lwe-Israel. . Ukufa kokuqala abantu abangakusho ukuthi amaJuda asinda ekuqothulweni kwesizwe, ukuqothulwa kwamaNazi eYurophu, awela kumaPalestine. U-Isaak Deutscher, isazi-mlando esidumile, usebenzise lesi singathekiso somuntu ozama ukubalekela umlilo endlini yakhe egxuma efasiteleni futhi ewela komunye umuntu. Umuntu ogxuma efasiteleni ngamaJuda asinda ekuqothulweni kwesizwe futhi umuntu okungenzeka bawele kuye baphuka imilenze nomhlane walo muntu amaPalestina. Lokhu kungachaza into njengokufa. Kodwa iqiniso liwukuthi kwakungeyona into ebulalayo uma ucabanga ngakho. Ngoba uma uya ekuqaleni kwakho konke lokho akungabazeki ukuthi iningi lamaJuda aseYurophu abalekela ubuNazi, belingathanda ukuya eNyakatho-Melika - kodwa lalivale iminyango. Babengathanda ukuya eBrithani - futhi babeneminyango evaliwe. Lawa mazwe amukele kuphela isabelo esilinganiselwe salaba bantu. Bazama ukuxazulula le nkinga ngokwenza iBrithani, eyayiphethe iPalestine, ivule iminyango lapho...
UDavid Goessmann: Ngaleso sikhathi kwakunokuningi ukulwa namaJuda eNyakatho Melika.
UGilbert Achcar: ... yebo, futhi wanezela kulokho ube nenhlangano yamaZayoni, nayo eyayilwa empeleni. Esikhundleni sokulwela ukuvula iminyango yomhlaba wonke, kumaJuda asindile inhlangano yamaZayoni yayifuna noma igxilise yonke imizamo yayo odabeni lwePalestine. Ngakho-ke babefuna lokhu kuhlangana kwabantu ukuthi beze ePalestine ukuze bakhe umbuso. Futhi yilokho okusemnyombweni we-State-Zionism ka-Theodor Herzl, umbhali we-Der Judenstaat. Lo mbono wombuso wamaJuda, isimo samaJuda, okuwumqondo owazi wona ngokwawo. Umbuso ochazwa ngaleyo ndlela uwuhlobo lwencazelo olungenademokhrasi. Umqondo wokwakha isimo esinjalo ezweni, okwakungelona izwe eliyihlane, kude nalo, ngezindleko zabantu bendawo, wawutshala imbewu yenhlekelele, manje esiye yaba nathi amashumi eminyaka ambalwa, kusukela ngo-1947. /1948. Ube nesizinda somlando sesibili, okwakungemva kuka-1947, isinqumo se-UN esahlukanisa iPalestine. Wawunesinqumo se-UN osishilo, 242 ngo-1967, lapho i-Israel iqeda ukuthatha iPalestine, idla lonke iPalestine, u-22%, owashiywa ngaphandle ngenkathi kusungulwa umbuso wakwa-Israel ngo-1948 ngemuva kwempi. Ngakho-ke, lokhu kwaqedwa futhi naphezu kwezipesheli ngasohlangothini lwama-Arab futhi naphezu kokuba semthethweni kwamazwe ngamazwe noma uhlaka lwezomthetho lwakhiwe ngu-242 wokuthula ngokumelene nendawo. Lokhu kushintshana kunqatshwe ohulumeni be-Israel abalandelanayo. Ngisho nesivumelwano sase-Oslo sasinamaphutha, ngoba isivumelwano sase-Oslo, ekusayineni isivumelwano sase-Oslo, u-Israyeli wenza isifungo sokuhoxa ezindaweni ezihlala abantu baseWestbank. Akuyona yonke iWestbank. Futhi [ba]qhubeka nokwakha izindawo zokuhlala futhi empeleni andisa ukwakhiwa kwezindawo zokuhlala ezindaweni ezihlukahlukene zaseWestbank, izikhathi eziningi ijubane elalilokhu lithuthuka ngemva kuka-1967. Ngakho, ngemva kwe-Oslo empeleni, esikubonayo eminyakeni eyisikhombisa iphinda kabili isibalo izifiki, izifiki zamakholoni, eWestbank. Ngakho-ke, lokhu futhi, ngisho, lezi izinqubomgomo, lezi ziyizimpande ezijulile zale nkinga. Futhi akukho ukufa kukho konke lokho. Kwakungenziwa inqubomgomo ehluke kakhulu. Ngisho, ngaleso sikhathi (?) abantu abaningi kwa-Israyeli njengasezweni lama-Arab, babenethemba lokuthula. Ngethemba ukuthi lokho kungaba ngempela ukushintshana ngokuthula ngokumelene nendawo. Nokuthi kuzokwakhiwa izwe lasePalestine. Sasinalolu hlobo lwamaphupho. Impela u-Arafat unalolu hlobo lwephupho futhi kwafakazela inkohliso ephelele. Kwafakazela inkohliso ephelele hhayi ngenxa yamaPalestine. Lokho kucace bha. Bayingxenye (?) kulo mbango, bangabacindezelwe, abasibo abacindezeli, abasibo abahlala khona. Lelo iphuzu elibalulekile.
UDavid Goessmann: Isixazululo singenziwa kanjani. Yini okufanele yenziwe ukuze kutholakale ukuxazululwa ngokuthula? Futhi yini indima ye-United States kulokho?
UGilbert Achcar: Ngingakubeka ngendlela ehluzekile, ngoba โฆngiqonde ukuthiโฆumuntu akakwazi ukuzibophezela ngentuthuko yomlando. Engingakusho: Yiziphi izimo ezincane zanoma iyiphi indawo yokuhlala esifundeni. Futhi lezi zindawo zokuhlala ziyaziwa ... lezi zimo ziyaziwa. Ngenxa yokuthi abantu basePalestine banokuvumelana abakusho ngisho emqulwini, kukhona idokhumenti evumelanayo yawo wonke, noma cishe wonke, amabutho asePalestine kusukela eFatah kuya eHamas, futhi wonke umuntu ubhalisele lokho. Lezi zimo ezincane ziwukukhipha ngokuphelele u-Israyeli kuzo zonke izindawo ezathathwa ngo-1967 kanye nokuhlakazwa kwezindawo zokuhlala. Ukuhlonishwa kwelungelo lamaPalestine lokuzibusa okungenani kula 22% wendawo yawo yomlando. Ngisho nalokho akubonwa ngu-Israyeli. Ngakho-ke, ngaphansi kwalokhu okuncane kakhulu, awukwazi ukucabanga nganoma yisiphi isiqalo sokuxazulula. Noma yikuphi ukuxazululwa phakathi kwamaphuzu acashuniwe kuzofana ne-Oslo [isivumelwano], inqubo engelona iqiniso, ewa ngemva kweminyaka embalwa kakhulu futhi iholele enhlekeleleni enkulu nakakhulu kunaleyo owawunayo ngaphambili.
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Nikela