Ungqongqoshe waseVenezuela Woguquko Lwezinguquko eGreater Caracas, uFrancisco โFarrucoโ Sesto, uchaza ngeqhaza lakhe emsebenzini kahulumeni wokwakhiwa kwezindlu, futhi uxoxa ngezinye zezinkinga nezinselelo uhulumeni abhekene nazo ekwenzeni umsebenzi omkhulu kangaka.
NGENA: Iminyaka embalwa manje ubunemisebenzi esezingeni eliphezulu kuhulumeni wenguquko yaseBolivarian. Uke waba ngungqongqoshe wezamasiko kabili, ungqongqoshe wezezindlu kanye, manje usungungqongqoshe wezinguquko zeGreater Caracas, kukuphi lapho uzizwa ukhululeke khona?
UFarruco: Ngingathanda ukulungisa kabusha umbuzo ukuze uthi, 'Kukuphi lapho uzizwa uwusizo kakhulu?' Maqondana nalokho, bengizophendula ngithi yonke into inesikhathi sayo. Ezingeni lomuntu siqu, ngizizwa ngiziqhenya ngokuba yingxenye yethimba elashintsha kakhulu uhlobo lokuphathwa kwezamasiko elizuzwe njengefa kusukela esikhathini esedlule, ukuguqulela ekubeni ukuphatha okuguquguqukayo ngaphansi kobuholi bukaMongameli [Hugo] Chavez.
Esakwenza kwakubalulekile, ngicabanga. Kusekuningi okusamele kwenziwe kodwa lelo qembu lisekhona, linomdlandla, lizinikele empilweni, futhi abantu abasha- cishe abancane ngaso sonke isikhathi - bahlala belijoyina futhi belicebisa. Ngicabanga ukuthi ngeke ibe khona indawo yokuhlehla, ukuphathwa kwesiko kusezandleni ezinhle.
Ngalowo mqondo, yebo, ngicabanga ukuthi lo msebenzi omusha ngeCaracas umongameli angibeke ukuba ngiwulawule ungaba obaluleke kakhulu, ngisho ukuthi, uwusizo ngokwesakhiwo, uma siwenza kahle, futhi sizokwenza uma singakha iqembu elixhumanisa. ukucabanga ngesenzo sokuguqula.
I-ENcontrARTE: Ekupheleni kuka-2010 kube nenhlekelele yemvelo nezinkulungwane zasala dengwane; uhulumeni kazwelonke waphinde waluthatha ngendlela eqinile udaba lwezindlu, umengameli wazithathela yena le nselelo. Inkulu kangakanani le nselelo? Iyiphi ingxenye yenkinga ehambisana nawe? Uhlanganisani umsebenzi wakho?
I-Farruco: Umsebenzi kokubili ungowobuningi kanye nekhwalithi, futhi isici sekhwalithi yiso esinikeza incazelo ejulile enseleleni esibhekene nayo. Ngakolunye uhlangothi, ukwakhiwa kwezindlu eziyizigidi ezimbili eminyakeni eyisikhombisa, njengoba umongameli wamemezela, ukuze kuhlangatshezwane nezidingo zabantu, futhi ngakolunye uhlangothi, ukusizakala ngomzamo ukuze kuthuthukiswe ukwakhiwa kwe-socialism. amagama enhlangano, ezomnotho, ezepolitiki kanye namasiko. Kanye nokwakhiwa kwezindlu, kufanele sivuselele indawo yokuhlala ngezindlela ezijulile zasemadolobheni nezenhlalo.
Iyiphi ingxenye yenkinga ehambisana nami? Ngingathi zonke izingxenye zihambisana nathi sonke. Njengoba kwaziwa, endabeni yami ngiyingxenye, njengongqongqoshe, woPhiko Oluphakeme Lwezezindlu Nezendawo yokuhlala oluholwa nguMongameli Chavez ngokwakhe futhi oludidiyelwe yisekela-mongameli wendawo, u-Rafael Ramirez. Kunabefundisi abayisishiyagalombili kulo mgwamanda; ngokusobala kuwumsebenzi onzima othathwa njengomgomo wombuso. Ukwakhiwa kwezindlu ngendlela enamandla kangaka kusinikeza amathuba amakhulu okuvuselela amadolobha ethu.
Njengongqongqoshe wezinguquko ze-Greater Caracas, kukimi, ikakhulukazi, ukuthi ngiqoqe futhi ngikhiqize imibono ngale ndaba, ngiyihlole, ngiyibeke ngendlela ehlelekile, futhi ukusuka lapho ngiphakamise amasu nezinqubomgomo ezibalulekile kumongameli kanye nohulumeni wakhe. Futhi-ke, ngiphendule imiyalelo enginikezwa ngumongameli futhi ngenze imisebenzi ephathekayo engiyinikiwe. Ngalokho, ngibhekise amabombo eHhovisi likaMongameli Lezinhlelo Ezikhethekile Nemiklamo.
ENCONTRATE: Inkinga nakanjani iwumthamo kanye nekhwalithi. Ezingeni likazwelonke kudingeka izigidi zezindlu kodwa futhi kubalulekile ukwakha idolobha, ukuthanda ukuphila okuhlangene, impilo yasemadolobheni, ngakho-ke ake sikumboze lokhu ngezingxenye. Umbuzo wenani uthathwa kanjani? Umuntu usebenza kanjani ngokumelene newashi, athole indawo, futhi akhe izinkulungwane nezinkulungwane zezindlu zokuhlala?
UFarruco: Ngicabanga ukuthi umbuso, okokuqala ngqa, ulungiswa ngesu elikhulu elibumbene, ukuze ubhekane nenkinga futhi uyixazulule ngesikhathi esifushane futhi esinqunyiwe. Umuntu uyabona ukuthi asikho isixazululo ngezindlela zonxiwankulu bese efuna ezinye izindlela. Lokhu kuzimisela kuyisihluthulelo. Ngalokho singabhekana, ngokomqondo nangokusebenza, ukuhlela, ukufudukela emadolobheni, izinsiza eziyisisekelo kanye nezingxenye zokwakha, ukusatshalaliswa, ukuhlelela ukukhiqizwa, ukwenziwa kwezimboni, izifundo zesayensi zokufunwa, ukwabiwa, ukuxhasa ngezimali, ukubamba iqhaza kwabaphansi, futhi okubaluleke kakhulu, imithetho efanele. ukuletha konke lokhu phambili. Kungathatha isikhathi ukuya emininingwaneni, kodwa umqondo yilokhu: ngokuhamba kwesikhathi njengento ebalulekile (ngokumelene newashi njengoba usho), sizoqhubeka nokufeza izinhloso zethu, ungaqiniseka ngalokho.
NGENA: Ngakolunye uhlangothi sicabanga ukuthi akukhona nje ukwenza amayunithi ezindlu, kodwa futhi mayelana nokulungisa, ukuqinisa, nokuvuselela indawo yokuhlala yasemadolobheni, akunjalo?
UFarruco: Yebo lokho kulungile, njengoba nje kwashiwo esikhathini esidlule. Amadolobha ethu awazange akhule, ekhulwini lamashumi amabili, ngendlela engcono kakhulu. Cha, ukukhula kwabo kwakunamandla kakhulu futhi kungalawuleki. Eminyakeni eyikhulu, okulingana esikhathini sezizukulwane ezintathu noma ezine, sasuka kubantu abayizigidi ezimbili nengxenye saya cishe ezigidini ezingamashumi amathathu. ICaracas, ngo-100, yayinezakhamuzi ezingu-1900 85,000. Futhi kubheke manje! Futhi konke lokho ngaphansi kwesimiso sobunxiwankulu, okwabuye kwaphawulwa nge-populism.
ENcontARTE: Uxolo, i-populism? Izitha zikahulumeni waseBolivarian ziwusola ngokuthi ungowabantu abaningi!
UFarruco: Hhayi-ke, i-populism yayisuka phambilini, ne-Adecos [iqembu eliphikisayo le-AD] kanye ne-Copeyanos [iqembu eliphikisayo laseCopei]. Uhulumeni wethu akayena owabantu abaningi, kodwa kunalokho, udumile, ohluke kakhulu! Kodwa noma kunjalo, ngizoqhubeka.
Ngakho-ke, amadolobha angaphandle ayekhula ngendlela embi kakhulu, ayenezinkinga eziningi, akhiqiza ukuhlukaniswa kwezigaba zomphakathi ngendlela esabekayo. Kungakho manje kufanele sihambe sishintsha amadolobha ethu kakhulu. Indaba yezindlu isinika isiqalo esihle sokubhekana nalo msebenzi omkhulukazi.
Njengoba nje u-Archimedes eshilo, kwakunguye akunjalo? Nginike indawo yokuma futhi ngizonyakazisa umhlaba, ngibhekise ku-lever. Hhayi-ke, lapha i-lever njengethuluzi lokuhambisa amadolobha ethu ekulungiseni okujulile yindaba yezindlu, ukufundiswa kwayo ngezigidi.
ENcontARTE: Ukubalwa kwabantu kwe-Great Venezuelan Housing Mission kubonisa amathemba amakhulu abantu abanawo kulolu hlelo. Uma sikhuluma ngokuqondile ngeCaracas, zingaki izindlu ezakhiwayo, futhi kuphi?
Farruco: Zonke izinkomba zibonisa ukuthi irejista yezindlu [ukubalwa kwabantu abadinga izindlu] izofinyelela enanini eliphakathi kwezigidi ezintathu nezine. Akuyona into encane! Kulungile? Inselele enkulu! Kodwa sizoqhubeka, ngaphandle kokungabaza. Yilokho-ke ukuthunywa. E-Caracas, ngisho i-Greater Caracas, sizonikeza impendulo ehleliwe. Okufanele ngikwenze? Ngiyabuza, siyasho yini emindenini ukuthi asikho isixazululo, kumele baye kwenye indawo? Kufanele sicabangele ukuthi yonke imindeni ecela izindlu [eCaracas] isivele ihlala khona, futhi lokhu kubalulekile ukunakwa. Akuyona imindeni ezoza lapha, vele isikhona, vele iyingxenye yesixuku esihlala emigwaqweni nasezindleleni, esisebenzisa amanzi nogesi, esiyingxenye yezakhamizi zaseCaracas.
Kwenzekani-ke ukuthi abaphili ngaphansi kwezimo ezihloniphekile, akunjalo? Basemaphethelweni, baminyene ndawonye, โโbaqasha ngaphansi kwezimo ezingezinhle, noma bahlala ezindaweni ezinganele, futhi ezimweni eziningi, ezindaweni ezisengozini enkulu. Well lokhu kumayelana. Ukushintsha izimo zokuphila zibe ngcono, zibe nesithunzi esikhulu. Qiniseka ukuthi inguquko izobanika impendulo. Phakathi kokunye, lokhu kuwuguquko lwabantu ukuze bakwazi ukuzihlomisa ngezimo zesithunzi esiphelele. Futhi njengoba uChavez engaphambili, lokho kuqinisekisiwe.
Ungibuza ukuthi zingaki izindlu ezakhiwayo njengamanje eCaracas? Kuzodingeka sihlanganise zonke izinombolo ezihlukene, okuhlanganisa nezivumelwano zamazwe ngamazwe. Kodwa ngingakutshela ukuthi ngaphansi koHlelo Lwezimo Eziphuthumayo cishe izindlu ezingu-28,000 zakhiwa ezindaweni ezahlukene zedolobha, kuhlanganise nasogwini. Zonke lezi, nezinye ezizoqala maduze, kufanele ziqedwe futhi zinikezwe ekupheleni kuka-2012.
NGENELA: Ezinye zalezi ntuthuko zike zabuzwa, kungenzeka yini ukuthi kube nokushoda kwezingxoxo nemiphakathi eyahlukene?
UFarruco: Kunezinhlobo ezimbili zemibuzo ngempela. Enye ingeyepolitiki, eholwa ngabezindaba, usuyazi ukuthi yibaphi abezindaba, abalingisi bezepolitiki bamaqembu aphikisayo. Lo mbuzo akuwona owethu.
Enye inengqondo; kumayelana nezithakazelo ezithintekayo uma umhlaba ongasetshenziswa kancane uthathwa. Umuntu uhlale enyathela okuthile bese kuvela isikhalo esivame ukuba nokusetshenziswa okuthile kwezepolitiki. Futhi, ngezinye izikhathi iqembu lomakhelwane licabanga ukuthi ukwakhiwa kwezindlu kuzobathinta ngandlela-thile. Angifuni ukucabanga ngobugovu obungena ngokunyenya futhi obubonisa ngisho, ngezikhathi ezithile, izimpawu zokucwasa ngokwebala noma ukucwasa ngokwezigaba. Sikuzwile ukuthi: 'Laba bantu enizobaletha lapha ezindlini ezintsha bazosenza silahlekelwe yile ndawo'. Ababoni ukuthi idolobha ngelabo bonke abantu nokuthi โimikhakha ethile yabantu abasezingeni eliphakathiโ ngeke ifundise ngezakhamizi.
Ngithi โabanyeโ kuzimpawu zokucaphuna ngenxa yokuthi kunengxenye enkulu yabantu besigaba esiphakathi ababambe iqhaza kulo mklamo wobuntu futhi uma bengenzi kanjalo, bagcina inani eliphezulu lokuzwela. Yingakho singakwazi ukuhlanganisa. Kodwa ngithi kufanele sakhe umphakathi olinganayo kanye nedolobha elididiyelwe. Kungumthwalo wawo wonke umuntu.
Ngakolunye uhlangothi, angiphiki ukuthi singase senze iphutha ekuqhubeni noma siswele ulwazi ngesikhathi esithile; ungakhohlwa ukuthi sisabele ngokushesha okukhulu lapho kunesimo esiphuthumayo esikhulu. Kodwa ngiyakuqinisekisa ukuthi akunjalo ngokwemibandela evamile. Iningi lokugxekwa kwezenzo zikahulumeni kulawa macala, akukhona ngobuqotho, kodwa kufihla izithakazelo ezithile.
ENcontrARTE: Esihlokweni esithi 'I-ecocide ezayo', u-Samual H Carvajal Ruiz uthi, "Basebenzisa umqondo kasimende nezitini kuhlamvu, olukhomba ubunxiwankulu obunonya kakhulu basemadolobheni", imuphi umbono ocabanga ukuthi isitatimende esinjalo sifaneleka? ?
Farruco: Umbono? Negative ngaphandle kokungabaza. Akusona isihloko esibucayi. Kugcwele izitatimende ezingamanga, ihaba, nenhlamba, ngisho nezinkulumo zomuntu siqu. Kodwa uma futhi ungibuza ngakho ngokwemibandela yezombangazwe, ngingakutshela ukuthi lesi sihloko siyasabela. Angicabangi ukuthi ingifanele ukuphawula okuningi. Kodwa ngingatshela uCarvajal ukuthi okuhlonza ubunxiwankulu akuwona umqondo kasimende nezitini, kodwa kunalokho ubugovu obujulile (kulokhu, yebo, ubudlova), bemikhakha ethile ecabanga ukuthi ingabanikazi bedolobha. Manje eminye imikhakha ephakathi ekwazile ukuhlala endaweni yesigodi futhi abeza kithi ukuzosho, phakathi kwemigqa, ngokuzithoba, bazifihle njengezazi zemvelo, ukuthi abantu abampofu abangeni, ukuthi baningi kakhulu, futhi ukuthi noma yikanjani bahlale lapho bekhona, beqamele ezintabeni, ukuze bangasikhathazi.
Kodwa sizokwenzenjani? Ingabe sizobakhipha eCaracas? Hhayi-ke, lokho kunengqondo yokuthi โkufanele bahambeโ.
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