Ezinsukwini ngemuva kombuthano obulalayo wobandlululo lwabamhlophe eCharottesville, eVirginia, kwashicilelwa incwadi emangalisayo ephephandabeni lendawo eFargo, North Dakota. Incwadi ibhalwe nguPearce Tefft mayelana nendodana yakhe, uPeter Tefft, owathwetshulwa ehambele umhlangano wangoMgqibelo wokushisekela abamhlophe eCharlottesville. UPearce Tefft wabhala, โ[Ayikho] neyodwa yezinkolelo zakhe ayifunda ekhaya. Asazi, asikaze, futhi ngeke, samukele umbono wakhe wezwe osontekile. [UPeter] wake wancokola, 'Into ngathi singabalandeli bobuFascist ukuthi, akukhona ukuthi asikholelwa enkululekweni yokukhuluma. Ungasho noma yini oyifunayo. Sizovele sikuphonse kuhhavini.' Petru, kuzomele uyifake ngefosholo imizimba yethu kuhhavini. Ngiyacela ndodana, ulahle inzondo, wamukele futhi uthande konke.โ Intando yeningi Manje! muva nje ukhulume nelinye ilungu lomndeni, uJacob Scott, umshana kaPeter Tefft, kanye noChristian Picciolini, umsunguli we-Life After Hate, inhlangano engenzi nzuzo esiza abantu ukuba bahlukane nenzondo nobudlova. Ubeyilungu eliholayo leqembu le-neo-Nazi skinhead kanye nontamolukhuni abade kwesokudla ngawo-'80s kanye no'90s.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Lokhu Intando yeningi Manje!, democracynow.org, I-War and Peace Report. Ngingu-Amy Goodman, njengoba siqhubeka nokusakaza kwethu okukhethekile. Ezinsukwini ngemuva kombuthano obulalayo wabamhlophe e-Charottesville, eVirginia, okumangazayo Incwadi yashicilelwa ephephandabeni lendawo eFargo, eNyakatho Dakota. Incwadi ibhalwe nguPearce Tefft mayelana nendodana yakhe, uPeter Tefft, owathwetshulwa ehambele umhlangano wangoMgqibelo wokushisekela abamhlophe eCharlottesville. Uyise, uPearce Tefft, wabhala, โ[Ayikho] neyodwa yezinkolelo zakhe ayifunda ekhaya. Asazi, asikaze, futhi ngeke, samukele umbono wakhe wezwe osontekile. [UPeter] wake wancokola, 'Into ngathi singabalandeli bobuFascist ukuthi, akukhona ukuthi asikholelwa enkululekweni yokukhuluma. Ungasho noma yini oyifunayo. Sizovele sikuphonse kuhhavini.'โ Awu, uyise waqhubeka, โPeter, uzofanele uyifake ngefosholo imizimba yethu kuhhavini, futhi. Ngiyacela ndodana, ulahle inzondo, wamukele futhi uthande konke.โ
Lawo ngamazwi kaPearce Tefft, uyise kaPeter Tefft, owamasha eCharlottesville. Awu, mina muva nje Wakhuluma kwelinye ilungu lomndeni, uJacob Scott, umshana kaPeter Tefft. Ngaphezu kuka-Jacob, ngaqhubeka nengxoxo yethu no-Christian Picciolini, umsunguli we-Life After Hate, inhlangano engenzi nzuzo esiza abantu ukuthi bahlukane nenzondo nobudlova. U-Christian Picciolini wayeyilungu leqembu le-neo-Nazi skinhead elihamba phambili futhi engontamo-lukhuni ngeminyaka yawo-'80s kanye no'90s. Ngaqala ngokubuza uJacob eFargo ngokwenzeka emndenini wakhe.
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: UPeter, isikhathi eside, wayekade eyisiqhwaga futhi engumuntu ongagxilile. Futhi mina nomzala wami kade sifuna ukuthi kube khona uhlobo oluthile lokusabela kulokhu okuvela emndenini, niyazi, uhlobo oluthile lokuphika. Kwakungemva kukaCharlottesville, ngemva kokuba ehileleke embukisweni owabulala umuntu, lapho sagcina sakwazi ukuthwala wonke umkhaya wethu.
Futhi besikade sivela emphakathini. Sasibeโkube namaphosta ayebekwe eduze kukaFargo abanye abantu ababehlangane naye futhi ababhekana nenzondo yakhe, uhlobo lokusho-nesithombe sakhe kubo, bethi, uyazi, โLona nguPete Tefft. . UngumNazi. Akamukelekile kulo mphakathi.โ Kwathi lapho lezi zingqwembe ziqala ukukhuphuka, abantu baqala ukukhuluma nami kanye nomzala wami, futhi saba ngathi, โYebo, ungumNazi. Kufanele uhlukane naye uma uyamazi.โ
Kodwa, niyazi, ukuya kulokho okwashiwo umfana owasungula i-Life After Hate, ngicabanga ukuthi umbono wakhe uvela kokuthile okujulile kunokumane uyazi, amaqiniso noma izindinganiso. Uyazi, ngempelaโngizwa sengathi kunokuthile okuphukile ngaye njengomuntu, futhi ngokuvamile uvame kakhuluโuzothinteka kakhulu, kakhulu, ngokuzumayo, uma umphatha kabi. Futhi uzoba nodlame. Ngiqonde ukuthi kunesigameko lapho ezame ukushaya omunye umzala wami. Ngakho-ke, ngiyavumelana impela nombono wokuthi lokhu kuvela kokuthile okujule kakhulu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ubuzwe bakhe obumhlophe benzeke kanjani? Wakubona usakhula? Ingabe uneminyaka efanayo, nakuba engumalume wakho?
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: Ngimncane kancane kunaye. Ngimdala esizukulwaneni sami. Ungomncane esizukulwaneni sakhe. Ngakho-ke, nakuba singomalume, sesisondele eminyakeni yobudala. Sifana nabazala, kodwaโ
AMY U-GOODMAN: Futhi kuyiniโkusho ukuthini ukuthi uyise umlahlile?
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: Bekuyini leyo?
AMY U-GOODMAN: Kusho ukuthini ukuthi ubaba wakhe umlahlile, umndeni wakhe umlahlile?
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: Hhayi-ke, kusho ukuthi akasamukelekile emibuthanweni yomndeni. Kusho ukuthi impela akekho emndenini wethu ongamamukela ezindlini zethu.
Ukuphendula umbuzo wakho wokuqala, yenaโuyazi, umndeni wethu wonke, ngisho ukuthi, sonke singabaqhubekayo. Sonke singabalandeli besifazane. Kodwa cishe ngo-2012, ngesikhathi somkhankaso kaRon Paul wokuba umongameli, uPeter waqala ukungena kulezi zindawo ze-inthanethi ezingavamile, njenge-4chan ne-Infowars nokunye okunjalo, futhi waqala ukugwinya zonke lezo zinganekwane. Futhi lapho esengene shรญ kulokho, wayelokhu eqhubekela phambili futhi eqhubekela phambili ngokufanele. Futhi konke lokhu kwenzeka ngemva kwethu. Waba isishoshovu samalungelo amadoda. Futhi-ke, eminyakeni embalwa edlule, wabonakala embuthanweni womndeni futhi waqala ukuklabalasa ngamaJuda. Ngase ngimbuza ukuthi wayezihlonza njengelungu lezwe elimhlophe, wayesethi, โYebo, ngingumfascist.โ
AMY U-GOODMAN: Khuluma ngokuthi kusho ukuthini njengoba umndeni wakho usuphumile, incwadi isishicilelwe ephepheni. Ukhishwe njengomunye wabamhlophe embuthanweni obuseCharlottesville.
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: Uyazi, kwafika izinkulungwane zabantu, lapho Yebo, Unobandlululo Lumkhipha, futhi babegcwele ikhasi lakhe likaFacebook ngokuphawula nokugxeka okuhlukahlukene. Kwaba nomlilo omncane wobungane, ngomqondo ongokomfanekiso. Kwakukhona uhlobo oluthileโkwakukhona abantu abambalwa, phakathi kwezinkulungwane, ababelandela amanye amalungu omkhaya wakithi. Futhi, niyazi, abanye abantu bebezama ukusho ukuthi laba abaphikisana nobufascist babi njengamafascists, futhi ba- niyazi, basebenzisa amaqhinga afanayo. Kodwa, ekugcineni, ngisho, uma ngicabangela izinkulungwane zabantu abalandela umalume wami, empeleni kwakungama-apula ambalwa amabi ayezama ukuhlukumeza amalungu athile omndeni wami. Futhi kwakukhona abanye abantu ababesikisela ukuthi thina kuphelaโsiye nje kuphela simphika, futhi kuphela nje simphika obala, ukuze sivimbeleโukuba sizisindise, ngomqondo ongokomfanekiso, ukuze sikhululeke ngokwethu icala. Kodwa futhi, njengoba mina nomzala wami sase sinesikhathi eside siphusha lokhu. Asikholelwa ukuthi umNazi kufanele amukeleke emkhayeni wethu. Futhi kudala sifuna ukuthi akhishwe emicimbini yomndeni. Asicabangi ukuthi ukwamukela amaNazi emkhayeniโemkhayeni, ukuvumela umNazi ukuba aye emicimbini yomkhaya wethu, kuwukuziphatha okufanele. Ivumela ubuNazi. Ithi kulungile ukuthi abe ngumNazi futhi usazokwamukelwa emndenini. Ngakho-ke, sajabula kakhulu ngokuthi ekugcineni sikwazile ukungenisa wonke umkhaya ngalokhu.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ngakho-ke, ngangizibuza ukuthi uChristian Picciolini angaphendula yini kuJacobโChristian Picciolini, owayekade engumNazi kanye nomsunguli waleli qembu, Life After Hate. Uma ungakhuluma ngalokhu osanda kukuzwa nokuthi umndeni kaJakobe usuphume kanjani ukuze ukhiphe umalume wakhe, umshisekeli omhlophe uPeter Tefft, owayeyingxenye yomhlangano owawuseCharlottesville? Ucabanga ukuthi yini engenziwa kuleli cala? Ngiqonde ukuthi usudlule kulokhu okuningi manje, abantu abanjengawe, ababengowabamhlophe base beqala ukushintsha.
UKRISTU PICCIOLINI: Uyazi, ngivumelana noJakobe ukuthi kufanele senze abantu balandise ngalokho abakushoyo nabakwenzayo. Kodwa-ke, angihambisani neqhinga lokuhlazisa umphakathi noma ukubiza umuntu ngenhloso yokumsunduzela kude. Futhi ngiyazi bekungeyona inhloso leyo. Inhloso kwakuwukuzama ukwenza isitatimende ukuze uPeter azi ukuthi umndeni wakhe uyamkhathalela futhi uzomamukela uma elahla imibono yakhe. Kodwa kwenzekani nokuthi kungani abantu bejoyina lezi zinhlobo zokunyakaza yingoba sebevele bazizwa bekhishwa inyumbazane, ngoba vele bazizwa bebandlululwa futhi benqatshelwe. Nokumdudula kude nokungamniki ukwesekwa kwesakhiwo somndeni, nginovalo lokuthi kuzomqhubezela phambili kulo mnyakazo, ngoba wahamba efuna okuthile. Wahamba efuna umphakathi noma umndeni nomazisi. Futhi uma umndeni, umndeni wangempela anawo, ukuqhubekisela phambili lokho, amathuba okuthi abuye ngoba ezisola ngento eshiwo umndeni wakhe mancane kakhulu, ngokubona kwami.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Jakobe, uma ungakhuluma ngokuthi kungasho ukuthini ukwamukela uPetru futhi nanoma yimiphi imizamo osuyenzile, njengoba aye ngokuya ephendukela ekubeni ngabamhlophe, ukuze afinyelele kuye ngaphambi kwalokhu kuchithwa kokugcina?
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: Nokho, ngiyakuqonda okushiwo nguMnu. Picciolini. Kulokhu-futhi ngingavumelana nalokho esimweni esivamile, uma umndeni laphaya unomuntu oqala ukuwela ohlotsheni lwengqondo lokubusa kwabamhlophe. Kodwa endabeni kaPetru eyedwa, kufanele ngicabange ukuthi usehambe kakhulu. Uyazi, ngaphambi kwekhefu, bengikhuluma ngokuthi unjaniโnjengomuntu, akazinzile futhi akanyakazi. Uyazi, ingxenye yesizathu esenza mina nomzala wami sifune ukuba alahlwe ngokusemthethweni emndenini, avinjelwe ngokusemthethweni emicimbini yomndeni, kungenxa yokuthi, ngokusobala, siyamesaba. Njengoba ngishilo, uba nemizwelo kakhulu, kakhulu, kakhulu, ngokuzumayo, uma ephazamiseke kancane. Futhi unemisipha kakhulu. Unamandla kakhulu. Futhi amalungu omndeni amaningi awazizwa ephephile eduze kwakhe. Ngakho-ke, nakuba kukhona ukucatshangelwa kokuthi, uyazi, singabhekana kanjani naye kangcono ngendlela yokuthi azizwe sengathi usengabuyela kithi, kukhona futhi ukucatshangelwa, uyazi, okwamanje, angase asilimaze? Ingabe bekungaba okunempilo ngokwengeziwe ngathi ukuqiniseka ukuthi akekho phambi kwethu, okungenani kuze kube yilapho eyedwa, esekwazi ukuthola indlela yokubuya?
AMY U-GOODMAN: Mkristu, kukhona amazwi okuhlakanipha lapha? Ngisho ukuthi, anizange nje nisuke ekuphathweni kwabamhlophe, inhlangano yeNeo-Nazi, kodwa ngiโeqenjini lenu, uma ningasixoxela izindaba, ethi Life After Hate, zabanye abantu? Futhi yiziphi izindlela eziphumelela kakhulu, ngama-anecdotes nezindaba ezithile?
UKRISTU PICCIOLINI: Impela. Hhayi-ke, uyazi, indlela yethu yokusebenza nabantu ngendlela yozwelo nozwelo futhi silalele abakushoyo, kunokuba siphikisane nabo ngokwemibono noma sibasunduzele kude. Futhi engikulalelayo yilezi zinto engizibiza ngemigodiโlokho okwakukhona endleleni yazo eyayiphambukisa. Bese-ke, umsebenzi wami uba ukugcwalisa lezo migodi, noma ngabe ukuqeqeshwa komsebenzi noma ukuqeqesha impilo noma ukususwa kwe-tattoo noma ukwelashwa kwengqondo. Futhi okwenzeka ngokungenakugwenywa ukuthi, lapho abantu sebehlome kakhudlwana, beqonda ukuthi babhekana nani ngaphakathi, asikho isidingo sokuthi basole omunye umuntu ngalokho abanomuzwa wokuthi kuthathelwa kubo, ngoba manje sebeyakwazi ukumelana nezimo futhi bayakwazi ukuncintisana futhi bayazethemba. Nokho, ngiyayibekela inselele imibono yabo, futhi, kodwa hhayi ngokuphikisana. Engikwenzayo ngibethula kubantu abacabanga ukuthi bayabazonda. Futhi ngethule abaphika UkuQothulwa Kwesizwe kwabasinde ekuQothulweni Kwesizwe, ama-Islamophobes kuma-imam kanye nemindeni yamaSulumane ukuze babe nesidlo sakusihlwa somndeni. Futhi yilezo zinhlobo zokuxhuma, lawo mathuba okwenza ubuntu, okubuyisela abantu emuva, ngoba abantu bajoyina lawa maqembu ngoba baphume befuna okuthile abangakutholi empilweni yabo yangempela.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Bengifuna ukuya kumalume wakho, u-Peter Tefft, osanda kukhuluma esiteshini sendawo UMDLALO I-TV eFargo, eNyakatho Dakota, lapho nawe, Jacob, uhlala khona. U-Peter uvikele igama elithi โi-fascistโ futhi wathi akawusoli umndeni wakhe ngokukhuluma kabi ngaye esidlangalaleni.
UPETRU I-TEFFT: I-Fascism ithanda umndeni wakho futhi yenza okungcono kakhulu esizweni sakho. Angibabambeli ngalutho ngabakushilo ngami, ngoba iyona nto ephephe kunazo zonke ukuthi yenziwe kulesi simo sepolitiki. Igama elithi โNaziโ liwukungacwasa ngokwebala kubantu abamhlophe.
AMY U-GOODMAN: UJakobe, njengoba umlalela, imicabango yakho?
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: Ngisho ukuthi, usho izinto ezinjengalezi: UbuFascist buphathelene nokuthanda umkhaya wakho, futhi elithi โNaziโ liyinkulumo yobandlululo emelene nabamhlophe. Ngiqonde ukuthi kungathi usehambe ibanga elide ngembobo kanogwaja kangangokuthi awukwazi nokumfinyelela ukuze umbuyise. Ngokusobala, ngethemba ukuthi lokho akulona iqiniso. Kodwa, ekugcineni, yileso simo esizithola sikuso. Niyazi, uโngizibona ngikude kakhulu kwesokunxele. Ngizithatha njengesocialist yentando yeningi. Futhi ukhulume nami ngokuthi yena nami, nabantu bami nabantu bakhe, kufanele sibambisane kanjani, ngoba sobabili silwa nokusungulwa okufanayo, ama-globalists afanayo. Futhi, niyazi, ngithi kuye, โUyazi, ukholelwa ekwehlukaneni ngokobuhlanga. Ngikholelwa ekugwemeni izinhlanga. Akukho ukufana phakathi kwethu.โ Futhi yena nenqwaba yamaNazi bacabanga ukuthi balwa nokusungulwa. Kodwa ukucwasa ngokwebala kuwukusungulwa, niyazi? Ngisho ukuthi ubunxiwankulu bakhelwe phezu kokucwasa ngokwebala kusuka phansi kuya phezulu. Futhi ngakho-ke, uma unalombono wezwe onjalo ubheka yonke into ibheke phansi nangemuva, kunguโmina njeโangazi ukuthi ngingafinyelela kanjani kuye nokuthi ngingamvimba kanjani ekwenzeni izinto athi uzozenza.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Christian Picciolini, uma uzwa uPetru ekhuluma, umalume kaJakobe, uthini umbono wakho?
UKRISTU PICCIOLINI: Nokho, kulokho engakuzwa kusiqeshana esivela kuPeter nalokho engakuzwa kuJakobe ukuthi lokho uPetru akushoyo kuphuma ngokuqondile, niyazi, imanyuwali. Uphinda zonke izinto azifundisiwe.
Futhi, niyazi, ngifuna ukunikeza ababukeli ithemba elincane. Futhi lapho uJakobe ethi, niyazi, usehambe kakhulu, angikholwa ukuthi kukhona umuntu owake wahamba kakhulu. Ngike ngasebenza, uyazi, amadragoni amakhulu we- KKK asebehlale iminyaka engu-40 futhi baqaphela iphutha lezindlela zabo futhi ngokuzumayo manje bayaqaphela, niyazi, akusekho lokho abafuna ukukwenza futhi nokuthi baye bachitha, niyazi, izimpilo zabo. Uyazi, mina, ngokwami, nginesikhathi esidlule esihle kakhulu. Ngenkathi ngiyingxenye yenhlangano, ngamenyelwa eLibya nguMuammar Gaddafi ukuze ngithole imali yokuqala ukuvukela umbuso ngokumelene namaJuda. Ngenza izenzo zobudlova ezacishe zabulala abantu abaningi. Ngaqoqa izikhali ukuze ngilungiselele lokho engangikholelwa ukuthi kwakuyimpi yobuhlanga eyayingenakugwenywa. Ngakho-ke, niyazi, kulokho, ngingashoโfuthi ngike ngasebenza nabantu ejele ababulale abantu bebala ngenxa yokucwasa kwabo. Futhi ngenkathi besejele, bathola indlela yokuzihlukanisa nalokho, okungenzeka ukuthi indawo enzima kakhulu ukwenza lokho. Ngakho-ke, uyazi, ukuze nje nginikeze ithemba, ngisebenze nabantu abaqinile, owaziyo, abantu abaningi abangasoze bacabanga ukuthi bangashintsha, futhi yilolo zwelo obabonisa lona, โโngoba yilokho obekuntula kokubili ngaphakathi. bona kanye nakubantu ababazungezile njengoba bekhungatheka, niyazi, izinkolelo zabathandekayo babo.
Ngakho-ke engingakusho kuJakobe ukuthi, ungalilahli ithemba. Uma unendabaโfuthi kusobala ukuthi umndeni uyamkhathalela uPetru; ngaphandle kwalokho, bebengeke bazisho izinto abazenzileโkodwa ningayeki.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Jacob, ingabe uPeter ubhale umbhalo wakho ngemva kwemashi yase-Klan ngoLwesihlanu ebusuku, ithoshiโimashi yethoshi, lapho amakhulukhulu abashisekeli abamhlophe bamasha eNyuvesi yaseVirginia, okwaholela ekutheni omunye wababhikishi ahlaselwe yisifo sohlangothi, njengoba eshaywe amathoshi e-tiki phambi kwesithombe sikaThomas Jefferson eNyuvesi yaseVirginia? Kodwa ukuthumelele umyalezo ngemva kwamarali ngoLwesihlanu nokuhlasela ngoMgqibelo?
UJAKOBO I-SCOTT: Yebo, wangithumelela imiyalezo ngemva kokuvula CNN izolo. Wayengithumelela imiyalezo, eqiniseka ukuthi nginguyeโukuthi ngangisohlangothini lwakhe ngasese nokuthi ngandlela-thile ngangimsiza ngokumemezela lo mhlangano ayefuna ukuwuqhuba.
Ngethemba ukuthi uโuyazikhohlisa ngalokhu nokuthi empeleni akanawo amandla okukwazi ukuhlela umhlangano, okungenzeka kube njalo. Kodwa uma ebambe umbuthano wakhe, uthi ufuna ukuwubamba ngo-Okthoba. Futhi uma kunjalo, khona-ke sizobamba umhlangano wethu wokuphikisa. Futhi siyethemba ukuthi abantu bazoza eFargo futhi basisize, ngoba, uyazi, sinomphakathi othuthukayo lapha eFargo, futhi ngiyaqiniseka ukuthi kuzoba nabantu abaningi lapha abafuna ukuphikisa, kodwa, uyazi. , uma uPetru enephrofayela enkulu yezwe-futhi kubonakala sengathi angase athuthukise eyodwa ngenxa yaso sonke lesi sigameko-angase akwazi ukuletha, niyazi, ngubani owaziyo ukuthi mangaki amaNazi, futhi angase akwazi ukudlula thina , indlela esibone ngayo kwezinye zezithombe ezivela eCharlottesville, lapho kwakukhona khona, niyazi, indandatho encane yabaphikisana nabaphikisanayo bese kuba ulwandle lwamathoshi e-tiki ebazungezile. Leso akusona isimo engifuna ukusibona lapha eFargo. Ngakho uma egcina enze okuthile, ngingethemba ukuthi singathola abantu abangaphandle kwedolobha ukuba beze bazosisiza.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Umholi weqembu lenzondo ye-Vanguard America neo-Nazi eyahlangana eCharlottesville, uDillon Ulysses Hopper, wayengumqaphi weMarine Corps. Manje, lokhu kuyathakazelisa kakhulu. Kukholakala ukuthi lolu lwazi luholele umphathi weMarine, inhloko yeMarines, ukuthi akhiphe isitatimende. UGeneral Robert Neller, umphathi we-Marine Corps, ubhale ku-Twitter, "ayikho indawo yenzondo yobuhlanga noma ukweqisa e-@USMC [i-US Marine Corps]. Izimiso zethu eziyinhloko zokuhlonishwa, isibindi, kanye nokuzibophezela zihlela indlela amaMarine aphila futhi enze ngayo. " Futhi kwakungeyena kuphela umkhuzi wamasosha asolwandle owabhala ku-twitter, kodwa kubonakala sengathi cishe wonke ama-Joint Chiefs of Staff asezishilo izitatimende, futhi kungenzeka kube yingxenye ngenxa yengqungquthela yezindaba kaMongameli uTrump engapheli, evuthayo, ne-bellicose eyathatha. indawo ngoLwesibili. Bengifuna ukukudlalela ingxenye yalokho okwashiwo nguMongameli uTrump ngoLwesibili mayelana nomhlangano obulalayo wokulwela amalungelo abantu abamhlophe eCharlottesville.
INTATHELI 1: Nithi kunenzondo, kwaba nodlame nhlangothi zombili. Ingabe abaphikisayo banecalaโ
PRESIDENT UDONALD trump: Nokho, ngicabanga ukuthi kunecalaโyebo, ngicabanga ukuthi kunecala kuzo zombili izinhlangothi. Ubheka-ubheka izinhlangothi zombili, ngicabanga ukuthi kukhona icala kuzo zombili izinhlangothi. Futhi angingabazi ngakho, futhi awunakungabaza ngakho, nawe. Futhi-futhi-
INTATHELI 1: Kodwa amaNazi kuphela -
PRESIDENT UDONALD trump: Futhi-futhi uma ukubike kahle, ungasho.
INTATHELI 2: Olunye uhlangothi lwabulala umuntu. UHeather Heyer ushonile-
INTATHELI 1: I-neo-Nazi yaqala lokhu. Babonakala eCharlottesville. Babonakala eCharlottesville-
PRESIDENT UDONALD trump: Uxolo. Uxolo.
INTATHELI 1: โukubhikishela ukususwa kwalowo mfanekiso.
PRESIDENT UDONALD trump: Abazange bazibeke phansi njenge-neoโfuthi wawunabantu ababi kakhulu kulelo qembu. Kodwa futhi wawunabantu ababengabantu abakahle kakhulu, nhlangothi zombili.
AMY U-GOODMAN: "Bahle kakhulu abantu." U-Christian Picciolini, umsunguli we-Life After Hate, inhlangano engenzi nzuzo esiza abantu ukuthi basuke ku-extremism yakwesokudla, shiya amaqembu afana ne-neo-Nazi, i-Klan, ithini imibono yakho, indima edlalwa nguMongameli Trump? Kunamaqembu afana ne-Anne Frank Centre la eNew York athi uTwitter kufanele avale i-akhawunti yakhe ngoba ugqugquzela inzondo nodlame.
UKRISTU PICCIOLINI: Ngikholwa ukuthi u-Donald Trump ungumdlali omkhulu we-inthanethi. Ngicabanga ukuthi i-akhawunti yakhe kufanele ivalwe, ngoba ngesikhathi sokukhuluma kwakhe kanye nama-tweets akhe ansuku zonke, uyazi, ehlambalaza wonke umuntu kusukela kubantu abakhubazekile kuye kwabesifazane kuya kubantu bemibala, kanye nezinhlangano ezisekelayo ezifana ne-alt-right kanye ne-retweeting white nationalists, lokhu. akusona isenzo esifanelekile somuntu ophethe ihhovisi elikhulu nelinamandla kunawo wonke emhlabeni.
The FBI ishicilele umbiko muva nje okhombisa ukuthi kunenani elikhulu lokuqasha okwenzekayo ngaphakathi kwezempi kanye nangaphakathi kwezomthetho. Futhi, eqinisweni, kwakuyisu lethu elihlangene eminyakeni engu-30 edlule, lapho ngihileleke kulo mbutho, lapho siqaphela ukuthi amakhanda aphuciwe namafulegi e-swastika nama-Klan hoods ayejikisa umbandlululo ovamile waseMelika omhlophe esasingakwazi. ukuqasha, kodwa besaba kakhulu ukujoyina ngoba, niyazi, indlela esasithukuthele ngayo. Ngakho sanquma ngaleso sikhathi, eminyakeni engu-30 edlule, ukuthi sasingeke siphuce amakhanda ethu. Sasizohweba ngamabhuzu ethu ukuze sithole amasudi. Sasizobhalisa ekolishi futhi siqashe emakhempasi. Sasithola imisebenzi kwabezomthetho, siye emasosheni siyoqeqeshwa futhi sikwazi ukuqasha khona, bese singenela ngisho izikhundla. Futhi sesikhona eminyakeni engu-30 kamuva nalelo phuphoโnoma lelophupho elibiโligcwaliseka. Manje, niyazi, bagqoke amapholi namakhaki, futhi ayahlangana. Abukeka njengodokotela bethu, omakhenika bethu, othisha bethu, abahlengikazi bethu. Futhi kunzima ukubahlukanisa, ngaphandle kwamazwi abawashoyo kanye nezenzo abazithathayo, ngokuvamile, esidlangalaleni, lapho bebodwa, abakwenzi.
Ngakho-ke ngicabanga ukuthi ukunyakaza manje kuningi, kukhulu kakhulu kunalokho okuyikho, ngoba sekujwayelekile. Kuthelelekile umuntu waseMelika ojwayelekile, ojwayele ukusho izinto ezinjengalezi ngemuva kweminyango evaliwe noma kubantu abethembayo, manje bazizwa benesibindi ngenxa yamazwi nezenzo nezinqubomgomo zikamongameli, abazizwa benesibindi. babe nomkhuzi oyinhloko obatholayo, oqonda imibono yabo futhi ozimisele ukubamela futhi abalwele. Futhi kuleyo ngqungquthela yabezindaba, empeleni, yilokho akwenza, ngokulinganisa izinhlangothi zombili futhi ethi kwakukhona abantu abalungile nhlangothi zombili futhi, niyazi, hhayi ngokuqondile ukubiza i-alt-kwesokudla-kufanele ngikhulume ngalokhu. Wayilahla KKK. Wagxeka ama-neo-Nazi kanye ne-white nationalists. Kodwa lokho akushiya ngokuqondile kwakuyi-alt-right. Futhi kamuva wabavikela, ethi, โAwu, babenayo imvume, futhi abanye abantu babengenazo.โ Ngokwazi kwamiโ
AMY U-GOODMAN: Futhi wakhuluma โnge-alt-left,โ abanye abantu.
UKRISTU PICCIOLINI: Yebo, futhi wakhuluma nge-alt-ayikho "i-alt-left." Kukhona abaseMelika, bese kuba namaNazi. Futhi mangisho nje, abantu ababengenayo imvume lapho, abantu ababelapho ukuze baphikisane namaNazi, awu, uMthethosisekelo wase-US wabanikeza imvume yokwenza abakwenzayo, ngakho babengayidingi. Futhi ngokuphathelene nami, lokho kungenye yezindinganiso zethu ezibaluleke kakhulu zaseMelika, amandla okubhikisha lokho esikubona njengokulimaza izindinganiso zethu eziyinhloko zaseMelika, okusadingeka, ngokungananazi, zidinga umsebenzi omningi.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Ngifuna ukuphendukela ku-tweet kaTrump entsha. Usanda kubhala, โKuyadabukisa ukubona umlando namasiko ezwe lethu elikhulu ehlukaniswa ngokususwa kwezithombe zethu ezinhle nezikhumbuzo. Awukwazi ukushintsha umlando, kodwa ungafunda kuwo. Robert E. Lee, Stonewall Jacksonโngubani olandelayo, Washington, Jefferson? Ubuwula bo! Futhi ubuhle obukhishwa emadolobheni ethu, amadolobhakazi namapaki azophuthelwa kakhulu futhi ngeke bukwazi ukushintshwa ngendlela efanayo!โ
UKRISTU PICCIOLINI: Amy, ake ngivele ngingene.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Amazwi kamongameli wase-United States. UChristian Picciolini?
UKRISTU PICCIOLINI: Ngivumeleโyebo, ake ngivele ngigxumele phakathi. Ake sehlise imifanekiso, noma kunjalo sidinga ukuzehlisa. Masibabeke emathuneni eNhlangano, ukuze abantu abakholelwa ngempela emafeni, nakuba mina ngingavumelani nalokho, basengakwazi ukuhlonipha izithixo zabo kanye namalungu emindeni yabo alahlekelwa izimpilo zabo ngeMpi Yombango. Kodwa-ke, ngicabanga ukuthi sidinga ukushintsha lezo zithombe esikhundleni samaqhawe amalungelo abantu, abantu baseMelika bangempela, abanikela ngezimpilo zabo ukuze balwele ubulungiswa kanye nephupho laseMelika. Futhi ikakhulukazi isifanekiso sikaRobert E. Lee esiseCharlottesville, ngingaphakamisa ukuthi isithombe sikhuphuke endaweni yaso ukuze sihloniphe abantu abathathu abafa ngalolo suku, niyazi, ngoba labo bangamaMelika eqiniso. Laba ngabantu okumele sibabheke. Lawa amagugu esiwahlonipha kakhulu njengamaMelikaโhhayi osopolitiki noma ojenene bezempi abakhuthaza impi, abakhuthaza ubugqila, ababenezigqila. Akusekho lokho iMelika emayelana nayo. Siqhubekela phambili, futhi sidinga ukuqhubekela phambili ngezindinganiso esizihloniphayo nesifuna izingane zethu zizuze kuzo. Ngakho-ke, ake sizehlise, futhi esikhundleni sazo masifake okuthile okumelela lokho esiyikho nesifuna ukuba yikho.
AMY U-GOODMAN: Lowo uChristian Picciolini, umsunguli we-Life After Hate, inhlangano engenzi nzuzo esiza abantu ukuthi bahlukane nenzondo kanye nokweqisa okunodlame. Ubeyilungu eliholayo leqembu le-neo-Nazi skinhead kanye nontamolukhuni abade kwesokudla ngawo-'80s kanye no'90s. Ungumbhali we Udlame Lothando: Izikhumbuzo ze-American Skinhead. Besikhuluma futhi no-Jacob Scott, umshana ka-Fargo, eNyakatho Dakota, ozalwa u-Peter Tefft, u-white premacist obeyingxenye yomhlangano wenzondo osanda kwenziwa e-Charlottesville.
Lokho kuyakwenzela umbukiso wethu. Uma ungathanda ukubhalisela izihloko zethu zansuku zonke, ungathumela igama elithi โdemocracynowโโigama elilodwa, asikho isikhalaโku-66866. Leyo yi-โdemocracynowโ ku-66866. Futhi uye kuwebhusayithi yethu ukuze uthole ama-podcasts ethu amavidiyo kanye nemisindo, yonke imibhalo yombukiso wethu.
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