Umthombo: I-Pepper ebomvu
NgoMatshi ka-2010, ijoni loMkhosi wase-Bhritane uJoe Glenton wagwetywa iinyanga ezisithoba kwintolongo yasemkhosini, ngokusemthethweni ngokungahambi ngaphandle kwekhefu, emva kokuba wala ukubuyela e-Afghanistan kwaye wayichasa esidlangalaleni imfazwe. Ekukhululweni kwakhe, wathi kwizihlwele zabalandeli bakhe: 'Ndifana kakhulu nabantu base-Afghanistan kuneenkokeli zam zezopolitiko nezomkhosi. Utshaba asingomntu ophambi kwakho ophethe umpu kodwa ngumntu osemva kwakho nangaphezulu okuxelela ukuba utsale isibhamu.' UGlenton wathetha naye Ipelepele ebomvuUDaniel Baker malunga nencwadi yakhe yamva nje Ubutshatsheli: Ingqumbo kunye neThemba kuBomi baseBritane baseMkhosini.
UDaniel Baker: Kwintshayelelo yakho ku Ubugqala, uchaza ukuba de kwasekuqaleni kweminyaka yoo-2000 amagqala avakalelwa kukuba abonwa 'njengenkunkuma yomhlaba' kodwa 'ukuqhwanyaza kweliso kamva ngokwembali, ngoku sibongwa emazulwini'. Kum, umzekelo wolu tshintsho kukuKhumbula ngeCawe ukuguquguquka ukusuka kwisibhengezo esithuliswe ngetoni 'sokuze ndiphinde' sibe sisixhobo soluleko sobuzwe. Sifike njani apha?
UJoe Glenton: Kubekho utshintsho olukhulu ukusukela ngeminyaka yoo-2000. Sifike kwipharodi yenkcubeko yaseMelika 'enkosi ngenkonzo yakho'. Iimfazwe zase-Afghan nase-Iraq zazingathandwa kakhulu, kwaye oko kwakufuneka kuqwalaselwe ukuze umgaqo-nkqubo wamazwe angaphandle waseBritane uqhubeke nokuba ndlongondlongo. Ukuqondwa kwaloo nyaniso kufakwe kwingxelo ka-2008 ebizwa Ukuvunywa koMkhosi wethu oxhobileyo kuluntu, ngaphambili nguGordon Brown. Ijonge ngokucacileyo indlela yokuphinda idume emkhosini. Lafikelela kwisigqibo sokuba ukungabikho kwenkxaso kwiimfazwe kwakungabangelwa kukuchaswa ngokokuziphatha kodwa ngenxa yokuba abantu babengawuqondi kakuhle umkhosi. Ngoko ke bekukho inzame 'yokubuyisela impindezelo' kuluntu ukudala imeko encomekayo kumgaqo-nkqubo wongenelelo wangaphandle.
Kungakho umkhwa [ngasekhohlo] wokuba amajoni ethu ngamapolisa axhobe kakhulu. Kodwa xa ujikeleza iminyango yeedolophu nezixeko zaseBritane, kukangaphi ubona umntu ephethe umqondiso othi 'ipolisa elingenakhaya'?
I-DB: Emva kokukhululwa kwakho kwintolongo yasemkhosini uye wakhankasela kunye namaVeterans For Peace. Isebe lase-UK lombutho ochasene nemfazwe wase-US wasekwa ngo-2011, kodwa kukho imizekelo embalwa kweli cala le-Atlantiki yemikhosi eqhankqalaza ngokuchasene ne-imperialism. Kutheni kunjalo? Ngaba amava akutshanje e-US okubhalisa ayinto?
JG: IVietnam iphinda igqabaza ngalo lonke ixesha lamagqala emfazwe eMelika, kwaye asinawo amava afanayo. Xa amagqala ase-Iraq nase-Afghanistan abuyela e-US, kwakusele kukho uhlobo lokugcinwa kolwazi malunga nokuququzelela amagqala-abanesizukulwana saseVietnam. Apha, sinento endiyibiza ngokuba 'ngamagqala abalulekileyo', kodwa awabonakali kancinci ngenxa yezizathu ezininzi. Apha, amagqala asekhohlo akatyekelanga ukukhokela kwinto yokuba ngamagqala. Abafani namagqala ephiko lasekunene ngaloo ndlela, abenza impazamo yokuba ligqala ngokuba ngumntu wonke ngokwawo.
I-DB: Ufuna abafundi badlulele ngaphaya kocazululo olubini lwamajoni 'njengabasebenzi abanxibe iyunifomu' okanye izitoji zama impiriyali ezingenakuguqulwa. Amagqala othe wathetha nawo kwi-counter stereotypes yeencwadi: kukho ama-welsh nationalists angasekhohlo, ama-Corbynites, nama-communist kunye nama-anarchist ex-force activists. Olo nuance alufane lubonakale phakathi kwezangqa zasekhohlo.
JG: Kungakho umkhwa [ngasekhohlo] wokuba amajoni ethu ngamapolisa axhobe kakhulu. Kodwa xa ujikeleza iminyango yeedolophu nezixeko zaseBritane, kukangaphi ubona umntu ephethe umqondiso othi 'ipolisa elingenakhaya'? Ubudlelwane bobungxowankulu bala macandelo mabini karhulumente bahluke kakhulu kwaye banezimvo ezahlukeneyo malunga nokusebenziseka. Ewe kunjalo, kukho ii-crossovers, kodwa kuya kufuneka ube ne-nuanced. Ukufika kwam ngasekhohlo, ndandikwipolitiki yeTrotskyist ngelo xesha. Kwakungo-2010, ngoko ke izinto zabafundi zazinkulu. Uninzi lwabafundi abashiyekileyo endidibene nabo babengabantu abakhululekileyo abanesimo sengqondo esibi kakhulu ngamaqela eqela. Ndiyarhana ukuba inxalenye yalo yayilulwandiso lwendelelo yoohlohlesakhe kubantu abangabasebenzi.
I-DB: Kuthekani ngobutshaba onokuthi ufumane kwabo banomdla othethelelekayo ngokupheleleyo ngakumkhosi waseBritane? Abantu abasuka kuluntu abaye bafumana ngokuthe ngqo ubundlobongela kunye nolawulo-uluntu lwabasebenzi bobuzwe kumantla eIreland, umzekelo?
JG: Ndiziqonda ngokupheleleyo ezo zimo zengqondo. Abantu abasebenzayo abavela eDerry okanye eBelfast okanye eTyrone abakrokrela kakhulu umkhosi waseBritane - kunye nabantu abakuwo - bahluke kakhulu kwi-snobbery yabafundi. Ndinganabela oko kubantu abavela kumazwe amaninzi kwihlabathi liphela umkhosi waseBritane uthathiwe kwaye waqhushumba. Kwakhona, ukuba siza kuguquguquka ngokwenene, ngoko ke ezo zimo zengqondo ziyaqondakala.
I-DB: Ngaphandle kwaloo mbali yolawulo lobukoloniyali kunye nongenelelo lomkhosi, uchonga 'isithethe sobuntu sangaphambili sasemkhosini' esinabela emva ukuya kuthi ga kwiimfazwe zamakhaya zamaNgesi eziqulathe ukuchasa, amandla obusoshiyali.
JG Ngokwembali, umkhosi ngamanye amaxesha ubuyindawo yomzabalazo wodidi. Oko kuphindaphindwe ukusuka kwiiNgxoxo zikaPutney ukuya phambili. Ngokukhawuleza emva kweeMfazwe zeNapoleon, kwakukho i-radicalism eninzi yamagqala, emva kweemfazwe zombini zehlabathi. Olo lugqabhuko-dubulo olukhulu lwamagqala asebenzisa uhlobo oluthile lwamandla odidi endiluchazayo.
Ndilumkile ukuba ndingayithandi, kodwa kuMkhosi oMtsha woMkhosi amajoni aqhelekileyo kunye namagosa aqala ukunyula abameli babo, abathi ke bacela umngeni kwiinjengele zabo kunye necawe yabo. Baye baqhubela phambili iingxoxo zobukrelekrele ezintsonkothileyo malunga nedemokhrasi kunye nelungelo lokuzikhethela, i-commons, ukuba bafanele bathabathe okanye bangayithathi imihlaba yabanye abantu. 'Ipalamente yaseCairo' ngomnye umzekelo omhle. Ebudeni beMfazwe Yehlabathi II, iqela lamajoni kwiziko laseCairo laba nepalamente ehlekisayo ngokuphenjelelwa ngootata balo amagosa. Kwisithuba seentsuku ezimbini, babecebise ukuba iBhanki yaseNgilani ibe yelizwe kunye nokupheliswa kwelizwe laseYiputa. Le mizekelo yembali iyakhuphisana, ndiyazi, kodwa isinika iingcamango ezinomdla ukuthetha ngazo, ubuncinane.
I-DB: Ngaba kusekho isiphithiphithi solu hlobo lwesiphithiphithi sodidi phakathi koluntu lwamagqala?
JG: Ndiyathemba njalo. Igama elithi 'ithemba' likwisihloko sencwadi ngesizathu. Nditsaleleke kakhulu kwimbono yothando yolunye uhlobo lweManyano yeSizwe yaBasebenzi beNkonzo yaBadala ukulwa nomkhosi wokulwa ngamadolo. Intshukumo enkulu yamagqala abandakanyeka kuzo zonke iintlobo zemibutho yabasebenzi.
Asikabikho โ sikhathazeke kakhulu. Kodwa iintshukumo ezinkulu, iintshukumo ezikwiLeveller, iintshukumo zasemva kwemfazwe yehlabathi ndixoxa ngawo onke amagqala abandakanyekayo asebenza njengenxalenye yabasebenzi, iklasi uninzi lwabo luphuma kulo. Leyo yipolitiki enomtsalane kwaye inika ithemba. Ayiyiyo ipolitiki yokwahlulahlula ngokwahlukileyo njengoko isenziwa ngamagqala asekunene afake emkhosini ngaphakathi. Bakhala 'ngezopolitiko zesazisi', ngelixa besenza olona hlobo lungenamntu lwezopolitiko ngokwabo. Kufuneka siyilwe loo nto.
UJoe Glenton ligqala, intatheli kunye nombhali we Ubutshatsheli: Ingqumbo kunye neThemba kuBomi baseBritane baseMkhosini (Uphinda)
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